From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ted Zlatanov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Integrating package.el Date: Tue, 05 Jan 2010 14:18:27 -0600 Organization: =?utf-8?B?0KLQtdC+0LTQvtGAINCX0LvQsNGC0LDQvdC+0LI=?= @ Cienfuegos Message-ID: <87pr5ocnl8.fsf@lifelogs.com> References: <87k4w5lbyb.fsf_-_@lifelogs.com> <87zl50jv52.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87d41rn3wt.fsf_-_@hagelb.org> <87k4vxiwlj.fsf@lifelogs.com> <878wcdjg9r.fsf@hagelb.org> <87637gh73j.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1262733964 9065 80.91.229.12 (5 Jan 2010 23:26:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 23:26:04 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jan 06 00:25:56 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NSImi-0005Bu-Ac for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 06 Jan 2010 00:25:56 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49981 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NSImi-0005Q4-DG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 18:25:56 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NSFrm-0003aI-Jl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 15:18:58 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NSFrh-0003Wl-FK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 15:18:57 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=58335 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NSFrh-0003Wd-B2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 15:18:53 -0500 Original-Received: from mx20.gnu.org ([199.232.41.8]:37367) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NSFrh-0006Bo-3f for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 15:18:53 -0500 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]) by mx20.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NSFrf-00017C-BN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 15:18:51 -0500 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.50) id 1NSFrd-0004Q6-4B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 21:18:49 +0100 Original-Received: from 38.98.147.130 ([38.98.147.130]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 21:18:49 +0100 Original-Received: from tzz by 38.98.147.130 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 05 Jan 2010 21:18:49 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 61 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 38.98.147.130 X-Face: bd.DQ~'29fIs`T_%O%C\g%6jW)yi[zuz6; d4V0`@y-~$#3P_Ng{@m+e4o<4P'#(_GJQ%TT= D}[Ep*b!\e,fBZ'j_+#"Ps?s2!4H2-Y"sx" User-Agent: Gnus/5.110011 (No Gnus v0.11) Emacs/23.1.90 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:Mpcn3/8ymxN8GDBCrAO4bOiMuoM= X-detected-operating-system: by mx20.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:119471 Archived-At: On Tue, 05 Jan 2010 11:47:46 -0500 Stefan Monnier wrote: >> The "package file" (analogous to a RPM/DEB package fike) should contain >> the real, final version of all the files. The package repository may >> accumulate metadata about all the package files it contains, but I >> should be able to copy a single package file to another system and >> install it. As a sysadmin I don't want package files to be >> indeterminate. For instance, how can I set up a local mirror if some of >> the files inside some of the package files are possibly remote? There's >> all the other security risks I listed in my previous note, too, >> concerning remote network access. >> This is a huge sysadmin problem with Perl for instance, where the >> liberal packaging standard and complicated build process make it hard to >> synchronize packages across multiple installations. I've suffered >> through that many times and hope it doesn't recur with Emacs packages. >> Some OS integration (DEB, RPM, MacOS X, etc.) would be useful, at least >> as a possibility. SM> OK, I'm not sure whether we're talking about the same things. I digressed too much, sorry. SM> The way I see it, there will be the following elements: SM> - a (set of) Bzr repository holding the package sources. Yes, with initial members "FSF supported," "FSF unsupported" (both hosted inside the Emacs Bzr repo) and "ELPA" (hosted externally, may not be a Bazaar repository at all). This is the storage backend. The "FSF supported" storage may be the lisp/ directory inside Emacs, for instance. SM> - a tool that will build tarballs from those sources. Yes, including the necessary package metadata inside the file. This tool will probably come from ELPA. SM> - an area where those tarballs are stored, along with some metadata SM> (think Debian repository). All of this is MHO: there should be three areas to parallel the storage backends above. They may be stored inside the backend or externally. The package repositories should be identified by a single URL; the ones that come with Emacs should point to a secure Savannah URL. That may address RMS' concerns about loading software over the network. Jonas' emacsmirror.org would be a fourth package repository, probably not enabled by default but easy to enable. SM> - a tool that can scan such repositories and downlooad packages from SM> them, obeying dependencies (think APT). This is package.el IIUC. SM> - a tool that can install/activate/uninstall a given package, ... (think SM> DPKG). This last one is what I tried to write when I wrote install.el SM> many moons ago. This is also package.el IIUC. Ted