From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: New maintainer Date: Fri, 02 Oct 2015 02:13:58 +0200 Message-ID: <87pp0yktyx.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <560CCEBA.9080607@online.de> <874miapdhs.fsf@openmailbox.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1443744899 22271 80.91.229.3 (2 Oct 2015 00:14:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 2 Oct 2015 00:14:59 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 02 02:14:58 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Zho01-00017g-4A for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 02 Oct 2015 02:14:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56739 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zho00-0003Br-80 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:14:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48989) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zhnzw-0003Bh-9B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:14:53 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zhnzv-0003Vk-Aq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:14:52 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:55823) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zhnzv-0003Vf-8N for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:14:51 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41408 helo=lola) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1Zhnzt-0003gN-SC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:14:50 -0400 Original-Received: by lola (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BB924E13CF; Fri, 2 Oct 2015 02:13:58 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: (John Wiegley's message of "Thu, 01 Oct 2015 13:46:10 -0700") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:190610 Archived-At: John Wiegley writes: >>>>>> Mathieu Lirzin writes: > >> What about Ethical skills? I would argue that technical skills are not >> sufficient especially for maintaining a major GNU package like Emacs. Using >> MacOSX & iOS as main operating systems and Hangout/Skype for communications, >> seems incompatible with the role to me. > > I also disagree with the spirit of the GPL, vocally in fact. If the > requisite for maintaining Emacs is that one use (GNU/)Linux and > espouse the philosophies of RMS, that is not me. > > However: are you looking for someone to act as an arm of the FSF, or > do you want the best possible Emacs? Well, the GPL is what makes sure that I actually have the right to get the best possible Emacs once it is distributed anywhere. A lot of "best possible Emacsen" lie by the wayside, starting with Gosling Emacs and arguably ending with XEmacs. Now Stephen Turnbull, the current XEmacs maintainer for longer than any of his Emacsen colleagues with the possible exception of RMS, is not making a point of "disagreeing with the spirit of the GPL" at all even though it's sort of foisted onto XEmacs. It's more like they are driving XEmacs under different work parameters than Emacs is driven, with different conclusions from the same set of principles. I don't think that "vocally disagreeing with the spirit of the GPL" would provide a maintainership retaining whatever it was that has enabled Emacs to claw back its way to the front time and again. There have been a number of heated discussions between RMS and various maintainers, but they did not concern the "spirit of the GPL" as much as they did the best choices to make in order to get the most from it. I wouldn't go as far as calling this "ethical skills" but yes, it seems like a cultural mismatch that would appear likely to cause considerable friction in choosing consistent priorities for ongoing development. -- David Kastrup