From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk (Phillip Lord) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Bloat in Windows (revisited) Date: Sun, 09 Jun 2019 22:16:42 +0100 Message-ID: <87pnnme9xh.fsf@russet.org.uk> References: <874l53g0yk.fsf@russet.org.uk> <83y32erdlt.fsf@gnu.org> <87imtieaiv.fsf@russet.org.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="245234"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.2.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jun 09 23:17:52 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5CK-0011eA-BG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 23:17:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38482 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5CI-0005wl-Nn for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 17:17:50 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:54754) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5Bw-0005V6-J2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 17:17:29 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5Bv-00083O-Kz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 17:17:28 -0400 Original-Received: from cloud103.planethippo.com ([78.129.138.110]:36314) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5Bv-0007XM-6a for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 17:17:27 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=russet.org.uk; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID: In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=LByt0QAMSwhcvpZw+eEgocs43DGpbijL+tW1Nfskfqw=; b=zaGYDQTiYk+6TxPCVU2NKIJ1j ws4DxdMfc88v5MpsRsnaiL2o02sSNZ2oE6+wbqk8WmRJdKpKpFPtGY2i8u4wLH9YAx/HyyWguphzg O8M6AyBOsWtSCZP01g4emmqD93yBho2LC+Fas3oPjVCq0RvUnF6ZXFUY2SC05qn2zvrYMT9hIsUDC 0kqZHTOUdV9UzAPSuVmgdLKL62VgXN8WQ415C3Q8KQO1vAm4eSUs9PX2CTy1DvDmOXCOBB2GnYMpS vQMFVpQW0b6t2eK8gTclAP8Z2zGzYzVqJkN7yK30VVs2j73RnzXg+gfbgRPwUkUAdw5XAo/69uYjU YoThDlUtg==; Original-Received: from cpc142652-benw12-2-0-cust953.16-2.cable.virginm.net ([82.21.43.186]:55570 helo=russet.org.uk) by cloud103.planethippo.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ha5BC-0005xX-Mx; Sun, 09 Jun 2019 22:16:42 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Thu, 06 Jun 2019 22:07:45 -0400") X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - cloud103.planethippo.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - russet.org.uk X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: cloud103.planethippo.com: authenticated_id: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-Authenticated-Sender: cloud103.planethippo.com: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 78.129.138.110 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:237366 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >> I think many editors would have "integrated" find tools even if this is >> just a call out to the OS GUI tool for doing the same. Likewise, spell >> checker. > > Yes, I agree with the general desire. I just proposed a hypothetical > way to make the slope less slippery by reducing the difference between > the tools that are bundled and those that aren't. > >> A quick "grep" for executable-find gives 300 hits. Many are >> languages (i.e. in progmodes), many are text processing commands or >> viewers. After that, we do not have that large a list. > > [ Not sure what is the relation between executable-find and this > discussion. I was thinking about catching the error you get from > start/call-process and then looking up some ad-hoc list of > known commands and their corresponding MSYS2 package. ] Oh, "executable-find" is just a cheap and cheerful way of giving some idea of what executables Emacs might well look for. >> I don't think that there are simple instructions on how to install these >> tools, other than "re-install this version of Emacs over msys2 (or just >> install Emacs via msys2) then add the packages with pacman". This is why >> I am asking the question. > > I'm too far from Windows to know anything about that. > So maybe indeed there's no good solution here. > > I was hoping we could write some Elisp that can download&install > a minimal MSYS2, and another that can ask MSYS2 to install some tool. I think this would be effectively rewriting pacman in elisp which seems like a bad idea. Pre-bundling seems the only sensible solution. People who want to install new dependencies already know how to do this, I think -- which is install the no-deps Emacs over an existing MSYS. >> On the other question, does excluding mingw-w64-x86_64-glib2 and subtree >> seem sensible? > > I'm too far from Windows to know anything about that ;-) Me too, alas.