From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Proposal: Forwards-Compatibility Library for Emacs Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2021 18:54:54 +0000 Message-ID: <87pmt0phj5.fsf@posteo.net> References: <877dfavmzw.fsf@posteo.net> <87czp2c6qd.fsf@gnus.org> <87o88lr63i.fsf@posteo.net> <87k0j9qf5t.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22394"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 22 21:09:18 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mT7cM-0005eU-JP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 21:09:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55902 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mT7cK-0004KK-Cv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 15:09:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52480) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mT7OX-0002c3-9d for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 14:55:01 -0400 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:56709) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mT7OU-0001aE-8y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 14:55:00 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 310CA240026 for ; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 20:54:56 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1632336896; bh=1RB24p0dqiiDavJcYd/ZfZ6MC1Inp+0lX0OSImLQgQQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:From; b=OODMQ+W+28t6S8p/JHqOvUBV/WVKxpUYR1qBjNqvkTKZvOkWrlj9ZAIa/LehnIgvp v+8kK2qaovJ/Xl0krqpXYH806tZKjVCZr3MbW8VSQSepgoWn0jyDMOKGdyya7N4yj7 wLG8O2ZYAuMen7RhQFoRWU1kW87N3KoSvsP18iM0QfmAlJuGMyVb1Fz83hc7PEKp1R 4uYtkuLE0joqtxmWrXXDHUT7ALyrR2J2FI/ayf2nzPzCAQuEnfFg9U1/8RjNsF+XnV XQprt6cjZw0CndNhoDtw5OqM4kW7lahT+PkEDl9/+pxSrfFnP+VDsLK3yDBKwpJXnL ooiYlGyyZEuHw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4HF6t73xGsz9rxH; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 20:54:55 +0200 (CEST) Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEYHHqUhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAp3GdmYJ6tm5McweY6dEvIYIiry+Oz9rU4MH6NHWK0Ee0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiQBBMWCAA4FiEEDM2H44ZoPt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJ CAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQtVrAHPRh1FyTkgEAjlbGPxFchvMbxzAES3r8QLuZgCxeAXunM9gh io0ePtUBALVhh9G6wIoZhl0gUCbQpoN/UJHI08Gm1qDob5zDxnIHuDgEYHHqUhIKKwYBBAGXVQEF AQEHQNcRB+MUimTMqoxxMMUERpOR+Q4b1KgncDZkhrO2ql1tAwEIB4h4BBgWCAAgFiEEDM2H44Zo Pt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwwACgkQtVrAHPRh1Fw1JwD/Qo7kvtib8jy7puyWrSv0MeTS g8qIxgoRWJE/KKdkCLEA/jb9b9/g8nnX+UcwHf/4VfKsjExlnND3FrBviXUW6NcB In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Wed, 22 Sep 2021 13:53:55 -0400") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:275333 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: > My conclusion is that it all depends and it can't really be decided in > the abstract. So, if you show a prototype things will be much > more clear. I attached a prototype to the first message? > Stefan > > > Philip Kaludercic [2021-09-22 06:48:30] wrote: > >> Stefan Monnier writes: >> >>>> I am not sure how this would help provide forwards compatibility for >>>> older versions? Are you proposing that instead of using >>>> file-name-concat, libraries use compat28-file-name-concat that is >>>> defined in a library for older versions? >>> >>> Yes. >>> >>>> My intuition would be that this wouldn't be worth the effort, seeing as >>>> most people would probably hesitate to use such long names. >>> >>> If the function is important enough that the author would otherwise make >>> its own local function, then I think they'd be happy to use that >>> slightly longer name rather than having their own local definition. >>> >>> If not, then it's probably just as well if they simply don't use it >>> (and that should avoid having the compatibility library accrue >>> too many definitions of too little value). >> >> This I'd describe as compatibility for convenience, but there are also >> examples where core ELPA implement general algorithms and functionality >> that could be used elsewhere too (project--buffers-to-kill and >> project--kill-buffer-check were mentioned as one example last year). But >> they cannot be factored out, because that would raise the minimal >> required version. The complementary example are external packages that >> hesitate to use newer functionality, for the same reason (I already gave >> the example of the second optional "interactive" argument). The >> infrastructure may not exist, but for anyone before Emacs 28, this could >> just be ignored away, while newer users get to keep it. >> >>> Stefan >>> > -- Philip Kaludercic