From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?B?R8O2a3R1xJ8=?= Kayaalp Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Gather a list of confusions beginner tend to have Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:07:38 +0300 Message-ID: <87o8meq711.fsf@gkayaalp.com> References: <875z8ortot.fsf@gkayaalp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7620"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: mu4e 1.2.0; emacs 28.0.50 Cc: =?utf-8?B?R8ODwrZrdHXDhMKf?= Kayaalp , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 10 12:12:05 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kGJYi-0001rO-EO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 12:12:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42038 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGJYh-0003LC-Fo for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 06:12:03 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44010) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGJUY-0002kS-Ei for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 06:07:46 -0400 Original-Received: from relay9-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.199]:43353) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGJUV-0007pU-T8; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 06:07:46 -0400 X-Originating-IP: 31.206.236.86 Original-Received: from localhost (unknown [31.206.236.86]) (Authenticated sender: self@gkayaalp.com) by relay9-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 25C31FF809; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 10:07:39 +0000 (UTC) In-reply-to: Received-SPF: none client-ip=217.70.183.199; envelope-from=self@gkayaalp.com; helo=relay9-d.mail.gandi.net X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/10 06:07:41 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:254963 Archived-At: On 2020-09-10 05:36 +03, Richard Stallman wrote: > I know it was long ago, but can you remember anything importantly > useful about Emacs that you didn't recognize in those first attempts? Indeed, tho let me try. I don=E2=80=99t really recall exact things but I= =E2=80=99ll write out my pathway in a couple of paragraphs; maybe it=E2=80=99s a pattern some people will recognise. So I came to it as someone teaching himself programming, probably sometime in 2012 or 2013. But I must have been aware of it before, given I=E2=80=99ve been using GNU/Linux since I was a kid. I was basically editor hopping as I was trying to figure out programming by myself, and in that timeframe used everything under the sun, basically. Emacs was particularly interesting as it was what =E2=80=98cool= Lisp hackers=E2=80=99 used. But IIRC the first few times I was trying to use it= more like Vim, i.e. editor with extensions and an rc file. For some reason, probably because that cool kids factor, I stuck with Emacs for a while. Then I worked a job as a Python dev for a month or so, around the end of 2013. The colleagues made me switch to Vim because they had a pretty decent Python setup, whereas my Emacs Python setup was nonexistent. And that stuck for a long while. I built a 1.5kLoC vimrc (which I=E2=80=99ve probably lost since...), and even wrote a couple plugins (one of which a colourscheme which seems to still see some little use in the community). When it clicked for me, what Emacs could indeed allow me to do, was probably around some time in 2015. By then I had moved on to pursue my education in humanities, and needed to organise my notes, manage my todos and agenda. That=E2=80=99s when I came back to Emacs, IIRC. Typed i= n a ton of notes into Org mode format. And I stuck with it from then on. At some point between some time after my switching to Vim and and later finally swithing to Emacs I must=E2=80=99ve read a lot, possibly through Ha= cker News, about Emacs and Org mode, and gathered a more refined view of what=E2=80=99s possible with these tools. And I recall being very frustrat= ed with the =E2=80=98unix way=E2=80=99 because it was never as neat as people = made it seem to be: I was having a difficult time fitting things together, especially for non-programming toils the switch to humanities brought about. I also should=E2=80=99ve first watched =E2=80=98A Tour of Acme=E2=80=99 by Ru= ss Cox [1], and it=E2=80=99s not an exaggeration to say it=E2=80=99s one of the most influential moments= in my life with computers. It must have clicked for me soon after that that I could make out of Emacs what I wanted: an =E2=80=98integrated comput= ing environment=E2=80=99 where I can make things work for me, and fine tune everything at almost any depth, and do all that interactively. That seems obvious to me today, but back in those few years it must=E2=80= =99ve been a puzzle for me how actually this kind of stuff happens, how people could make more use of Emacs than just as a text editor or IDE. Hopefully that=E2=80=99s not one long wall of text with a completely irrele= vant personal story. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DdP1xVpMPn8M -- =C4=B0. G=C3=B6ktu=C4=9F Kayaalp / @cadadr / pgp: 024C 30DD 597D 142B 49AC 40EB 465C D949 B101 2427