From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Sean Whitton Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Adding missing C-x 5 C-j and C-x t C-j commands Date: Mon, 23 May 2022 06:54:20 -0700 Message-ID: <87o7zowe0j.fsf@athena.silentflame.com> References: <87a6b9xs22.fsf@athena.silentflame.com> <83fsl16l5l.fsf@gnu.org> <871qwkyhfx.fsf@athena.silentflame.com> <87y1ysx2sj.fsf@athena.silentflame.com> <86h75g1xuc.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <791EABD2-57A9-4C71-9BB3-88F691CE13DF@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="15359"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Notmuch/0.36 Emacs/29.0.50 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) To: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org, Juri Linkov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon May 23 15:55:59 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nt8XN-0003eW-4f for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 23 May 2022 15:55:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35272 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nt8XL-0001eU-Kl for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 23 May 2022 09:55:55 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:36746) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nt8Vu-0000UR-I3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 23 May 2022 09:54:26 -0400 Original-Received: from wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com ([64.147.123.21]:51001) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nt8Vs-00049g-Lp; Mon, 23 May 2022 09:54:26 -0400 Original-Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5046A320070D; Mon, 23 May 2022 09:54:22 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 23 May 2022 09:54:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=spwhitton.name; h=cc:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject :subject:to:to; s=fm3; t=1653314061; x=1653400461; bh=oJG5s39Fqv y/HklSyCvFcEmSzaoXmerXGo+DPm/2aJg=; b=kLYY46wpVQRVDEZ6GNEt3FIBJl Clw5xFKwsZMIEcLqzrW7gk2YMI5MZ3l0BUpta5tb/hVFcUrBb/sUqralQKYEQ5BU x1lEeTA6dw91VgAzeMReTmAHydOnct3hqz5/ei2y/YpfH61DPhlNPiYXkfUEPamQ kTXdFRqQo1eiEONSMYCq1cVT1Q8KWokTF4Q0aviXE0S1w23HeahnWpT6cJ3SPL8g EUcsei1wdt5aOPCkCV69zrcWXYQLa7ApFOktttzowj5THdaoxpfISLvJFiQjVljz D5SCchqOH5VPqWhZi6a8Sb/X5qrkIfBX11IlvKaqziS2JwPFrFCitxQuFnGg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:date:date:feedback-id :feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to :x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s= fm1; t=1653314061; x=1653400461; bh=oJG5s39Fqvy/HklSyCvFcEmSzaoX merXGo+DPm/2aJg=; b=wZ7ynGAP3pHObddEnqmbe8sSM9Y/ltj6OQiCliOfwXFd +ZPmpnJzbByW61zCWPRc7+k6oQoJ7cWWI0n0To20XlXJtA7NGWQEEr41Q2+MGQYc 0IV+Wj4Cc1diXu/9f12pFFGcdc0C786hrLP/+ZS3RDGifK1JpqJgFDV9IdfM3mBJ 0CtklOqtxirrVPGFeB3Hr27C+Lm80O7C0TDYPAl83UiMpGHxnGYDxx2oKQDw5H0A 9NT9SAGfEvaESz9x06CHYaC2gUCvZajMsEHns4J7rcNTpdCzYJA+OAmdRcm4EHzL uElWjkkuM4pBPJsnuRyaGQO1Da5x1t+1G27USuX7Mg== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvfedrjedugdeflecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefhvffujghffgffkfggtgesthdttddttdertdenucfhrhhomhepufgvrghnucgh hhhithhtohhnuceoshhpfihhihhtthhonhesshhpfihhihhtthhonhdrnhgrmhgvqeenuc ggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeelgeeggfdvieejvdfhudfggeetgfekkeeuieeljeejhedugeeg feetgefhueffkeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfh hrohhmpehsphifhhhithhtohhnsehsphifhhhithhtohhnrdhnrghmvg X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i23c04076:Fastmail Original-Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Mon, 23 May 2022 09:54:21 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: by athena.silentflame.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id A23431B58C1; Mon, 23 May 2022 13:54:20 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <791EABD2-57A9-4C71-9BB3-88F691CE13DF@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.147.123.21; envelope-from=spwhitton@spwhitton.name; helo=wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -26 X-Spam_score: -2.7 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, GAPPY_SUBJECT=0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:290159 Archived-At: Hello, On Mon 23 May 2022 at 12:16pm +03, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > I don't think we agreed to have full symmetry between C-x 4 and C-x 5. I see no special reason for 100% consistency here. Simple key sequences are at a premium, and we shouldn't usurp them just because we can. > > Any user who wants a C-x 5 binding for dired-jump can have such a binding for him or herself. But why do this by default for everyone? I certainly agree with you that we shouldn't bind things into C-x 5 willy-nilly. In this case, however, it's not just because we can, but because it makes things consistent with C-x 4 in a way that's helpful. As Juri has determined, it's almost the only one that doesn't match right now. Here's a different way to look at it. Given the existing symmetry between C-x 4 and C-x 5, if we later bind anything *other* than dired-jump-other-window to C-x 5 C-j, we would be introducing a special exception that users would have to remember. That is, the existing symmetry has already implicitly semi-reserved C-x 5 C-j for dired-jump-other-window, by giving us a strong reason not to put anything else there. So, given that I'm unlikely to be the only person who has naturally tried to reach for C-x 5 C-j, let's make the implicit semi-reservation explicit. This command is as useful as C-x 4 C-j. -- Sean Whitton