From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin_Le_Gouguec?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Convert README.org to plain text README while installing package Date: Wed, 08 Jun 2022 08:41:14 +0200 Message-ID: <87o7z3odx1.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87leuca7v7.fsf@disroot.org> <87czfopmsd.fsf@gnu.org> <87h74ztshe.fsf@gmx.de> <871qw31ois.fsf@yahoo.com> <8735gj4ceo.fsf@gnu.org> <87ee038ipt.fsf@gmx.de> <87o7z61v59.fsf@gmail.com> <87bkv527p5.fsf@gmail.com> <87k09ttiad.fsf@yahoo.com> <87czflas36.fsf@gmail.com> <874k0wucxg.fsf@yahoo.com> <87pmjknmrf.fsf@gmail.com> <87r140rnxb.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="32208"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Tim Cross , Alan Mackenzie , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Jun 08 08:43:30 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nypPd-0008CU-Gm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 08 Jun 2022 08:43:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57658 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nypPc-0006Io-27 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 08 Jun 2022 02:43:28 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43970) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nypNX-0004ht-9E for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jun 2022 02:41:19 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x433.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::433]:40820) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nypNV-0005Ze-KI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jun 2022 02:41:19 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x433.google.com with SMTP id k16so26938776wrg.7 for ; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 23:41:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jhVbgpkg5Xp7W65p9E/7QhHW279Fi0qxIqw7b07KKz8=; b=UhX5i8Uw7gO0bcp66x5gBPh+EwFYLiBekKhLz/3IfrOPyU2hGdqZtLzel3ABmtTcNj UNRh9GUjc89En0uwQr5FE3vFEInPDVHUgLi3uWyurCo/byox7vR9CO8a6toV+uiuvQOZ rihbfyhMPaSHnGjkQMOuqEIGv7mjjw/VKPx7JRgbCTCUCY7M049ErrxfJyKfOD3DarX0 +m76bk22ohNSWljaOpeTHdEpgViJ9ZufWjCYmHrEXffKBx3/2ZcNZIuIBarIZFlWcYSp WCNzKwIZmhjumkdHdISjwdZc5KD8OuwlabDjOM3WcCHk/RHf5vkgJhkXOlDi+90fYxbU zZmg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jhVbgpkg5Xp7W65p9E/7QhHW279Fi0qxIqw7b07KKz8=; b=CMP6IIDAWF4aRSfPHXdyhbNU43BIdHVdF43TU6dZ70r47LJQOyrz8QXXACS4EN4Vrc 56hgf4LvUTHy91Jrv2HpiF08hxzls2N0E22xudsViKBPKbO2Tcu2txg2moSQNrTKm3jo pMBCPsVHhwW5RbwjBFXGIo1sLrE+lqlh6SL/k3+xhoZ6PCkBssxYqM2V2JFTTmVtKQiT wKuaIQMIKPMeM9Ewx8TZBV520jzUrF7ZcClGtiaxK4+NjcTilIrMkygWnZoH12SG9SAr p6kV/KgUaokm3CY7fZrlQLCmXQ/vrd+cE0fk96VpckBZ7gRPwgNsAIUExvklC4cycKPP T7Fg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531u4VK/oJ4WTF5FM9F+vwtQgpP+rYoxGsCf6X81x81V7CbHpyUc k5514MEArsYKYSG4kupKjeTOoPzmFVQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxXm564OeVB/EFM0xcVzexCL+DyOWTzsZQzJvpV19JXFC69OLxrAnvqGRIC4LULKMsJu5X2/g== X-Received: by 2002:adf:dc87:0:b0:216:cfca:65d with SMTP id r7-20020adfdc87000000b00216cfca065dmr19708690wrj.316.1654670475840; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 23:41:15 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from amdahl30 ([2a01:e0a:253:fe0:2ef0:5dff:fed2:7b49]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r8-20020adfdc88000000b0021576694d9dsm13384398wrj.97.2022.06.07.23.41.14 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 07 Jun 2022 23:41:15 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87r140rnxb.fsf@yahoo.com> (Po Lu's message of "Wed, 08 Jun 2022 08:36:48 +0800") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::433; envelope-from=kevin.legouguec@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x433.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:290900 Archived-At: Po Lu writes: > K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec writes: > >> So your paraphrasing ("expecting someone to go through the entire Org >> manual in order to write and edit README files") struck me as >> disconnected from (my own understanding of) Tim's argument: AFAIU, >> >> * he wasn't saying _Org users_ need to go through the manual, >> >> * he was confronting the "784 bindings" argument by saying it was not a >> particularly useful heuristic, inviting _us_ (participants of the >> present discussion) to check for ourselves what proportion of these >> bindings are actually relevant to the discussion. >> >> Again though, cannot speak for Tim; I can only explain my undertanding >> of the discussion, and why I was dumbfounded by your reply. > > Going through the key bindings in the Org manual means to essentially > read the entire manual. Yes, going through keybindings =E2=89=88 reading the entire manual. My poi= nt is that asking _participants of a discussion_ to do X in order to make the stakes clearer (my understanding of Tim's position) =E2=89=AA asking anyone who wants to write and edit README files to do X (your paraphrasing) >> If there's been advocating for all documentation to be written in Org, >> I've (dis)missed that, so sorry for not following closely enough. > > That's how this discussion started, with Stefan K asking for all > documentation to be written in Org mode. Assuming you are referring to ? The actual OP, <87leuca7v7.fsf@disroot.org>, started with something much more modest: converting Org READMEs to plaintext. Then, AFAIU, came ideas to (in no particular order, and not mutually exclusive) (1) render the Org syntax rather than converting it "down" to plaintext, (2) enable Org wholesale, (3) break down Org into smaller pieces in order to make it less of a pain to fit the "display a rich README" use-case. I admit to focusing on those points of the discussion, forgetting about StefanK's message, and then getting very confused why Org's complexity _as an authorship tool_ mattered so much. Apologies for not paying enough attention. Anyway, Philip posted a patch to the effect of what the OP suggested in <877d5ut6z6.fsf@posteo.net>. Digging into the ELPA admin branch, I also see that the machinery for the conversion is exactly what I expected: it lets Org's export library do the heavy lifting. So AFAICT reason prevailed; package maintainers who enjoy writing READMEs in Org can keep doing so without impacting their users; and despite the forecast for today being pretty rainy over here, I'm starting my day in a resolutely sunny mood.