From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Robert Pluim Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Org mode and Emacs Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2022 13:04:26 +0200 Message-ID: <87o7v29z2d.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87y1u8b1gj.fsf@gmail.com> <8735cgot9x.fsf@gnu.org> <83leq7naql.fsf@gnu.org> <86o7v3ryan.fsf@gmail.com> <87wn9qfyv6.fsf@gnu.org> <87r0zy63u3.fsf@localhost> <87illa5uli.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24943"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Jean Louis , Bastien , Tim Cross , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 26 13:09:44 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oclza-0006Fx-JU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 13:09:42 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40914 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oclzZ-0002s8-4X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 07:09:41 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34962) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oclua-000065-GL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 07:04:34 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x42e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42e]:44986) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ocluY-0006G9-VH; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 07:04:32 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x42e.google.com with SMTP id c11so9584149wrp.11; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 04:04:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date :gmane-reply-to-list:references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from :to:cc:subject:date; bh=HWNy27VrLNKcbnum2H5sR+7w40v+zl7lgkjg2Q2Agoo=; b=NAB/w+oQ2kIl+tufPZeae196csuoTcpmhJYkfr7WFazGrM+1S8Pk5qI51iJMbL3BkQ O03NrMUTMHiWMLTt88PqjNlA7JmHg9GkQJ1YoemB3wpxhQAwdaS0oNp1HAQqBZCDwkNP ixiXwFoyy+AajNhMj48B6lQHhGUqXpEQbJZawvgKUed+4aCQpLRHO1w+6dTjNYfUg8Nb vK5rUin3oFOMLZZqwLIJIGxoXb+lopK91P15JmuAsnPxOAZLu+N6ItyLCDQfLn4Dc+yr 3bnaEh4De1qZB4GyIg0E8dtZbHJsC6M+XO7mibY5lki6RKOB4r6LZSrqyL850O8Mg+cZ e0sg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date :gmane-reply-to-list:references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=HWNy27VrLNKcbnum2H5sR+7w40v+zl7lgkjg2Q2Agoo=; b=k7INaCsESATPJNhdk1/0hejK1oIynUfv8JTcr8pmG8EtSHz1iBmrEAYlUR0T4yTP4+ O4VG+anxcWRgOILVoQ61Gc9pMPSoq3FZC3OdUuHUgRTAL3EK3nOy3lWsws5Z4FLOcgb2 XvxlVDR5uqAhcGSHJBZSYHvmFgrYdHrSg0ZK85No/N0/T2UAn4vDBi9klXWJcNFHVFfN n2DOarTQ92g5xPWH+AMmwxKovvEe3xKGjjJjuGo3QankCw8+hAAExFe3WONTYXxSWotg s+1Ul3w+WvaypDTc9bhUjo3jmLLXLRkOV5IqtwXRr/7uH9JLEf1PsuUifYQJhaPP9Lfr 5cEg== X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf0EFcLuLIuvI6/vIK9f875jPzeh4BR7j/xH4rUYhA0SsjxUlF8F A7EyLJdzixjcrzn/eSe5ELItTirpQmI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM5g6xfDexXSw3fskOFcajHYtkSEZb0akO3UlUbqOPs3n92us8mdC8jVbSPNgQa1t9DLSZVJnA== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:47c5:0:b0:22a:6ce9:3fb1 with SMTP id o5-20020a5d47c5000000b0022a6ce93fb1mr12781002wrc.666.1664190267690; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 04:04:27 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from rltb ([2a01:e0a:3f3:fb50:2e48:1c6b:2114:6f3b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p12-20020a05600c358c00b003b482fbd93bsm11054566wmq.24.2022.09.26.04.04.26 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Mon, 26 Sep 2022 04:04:27 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87illa5uli.fsf@localhost> (Ihor Radchenko's message of "Mon, 26 Sep 2022 17:54:33 +0800") Gmane-Reply-To-List: yes Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42e; envelope-from=rpluim@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42e.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:296276 Archived-At: >>>>> On Mon, 26 Sep 2022 17:54:33 +0800, Ihor Radchenko said: Ihor> 1. Switching to texinfo will improve Emacs coherence and potentia= lly Ihor> increase the pool of Emacs contributors familiar with texinfo = (by Ihor> pulling some of the Org contributors) Ihor> 2. On the other hand, switching from Org to texinfo sources on Or= g side Ihor> will require Org contributors to learn texinfo, which they do = not Ihor> really need now. Ihor> 3. Yet, switching from Org to texinfo will allow Emacs contributo= rs to Ihor> send patches in familiar texinfo format to Org. Ihor> From the perspective of Emacs, using texinfo sources is a good th= ing. Ihor> From the perspective of Org, it is not that obvious. Ihor> Hence this discussion. As someone who has written the odd bit of Emacs documentation and (less) org-mode documentation, I find the cognitive load of texinfo or org to be about the same [1][2]; whichever one I wrote most recently is relatively easy to use, and the other I need to relearn. I suspect the same is true for most casual submitters of documentation patches. Robert Footnotes: [1] In a lot of cases it=CA=BCs "scroll around to see what the rest of the document is doing and just copy that", which is perhaps inefficent of my time, but works. [2] The load would be less if I didn=CA=BCt *also* have to write Markdown for work, but Emacs help a lot with that. =F0=9F=98=80 --=20