From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juri Linkov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Using eww as browser for Emacs internals and documentation (was: bug#38713: 27.0.50; eww doesn't handle protocols other than https?) Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2019 02:36:30 +0200 Organization: LINKOV.NET Message-ID: <87mubhduqh.fsf_-_@mail.linkov.net> References: <87pngggdma.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <87bls0t00q.fsf@gnus.org> <87woammyb4.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <83lfr1wxo6.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="183544"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) Cc: larsi@gnus.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Dec 25 03:15:01 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1ijwCS-000laC-T9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 25 Dec 2019 03:15:01 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43182 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ijwCR-0000YO-83 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 21:14:59 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38064) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ijwCJ-0000V7-UG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 21:14:53 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ijwCI-00078n-Lr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 21:14:51 -0500 Original-Received: from crocodile.birch.relay.mailchannels.net ([23.83.209.45]:14744) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ijwCG-00075a-NR; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 21:14:48 -0500 X-Sender-Id: dreamhost|x-authsender|jurta@jurta.org Original-Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A10B3C094C; Wed, 25 Dec 2019 02:14:47 +0000 (UTC) Original-Received: from pdx1-sub0-mail-a50.g.dreamhost.com (100-96-196-67.trex.outbound.svc.cluster.local [100.96.196.67]) (Authenticated sender: dreamhost) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 3D45E3C0824; Wed, 25 Dec 2019 02:14:46 +0000 (UTC) X-Sender-Id: dreamhost|x-authsender|jurta@jurta.org Original-Received: from pdx1-sub0-mail-a50.g.dreamhost.com ([TEMPUNAVAIL]. [64.90.62.162]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.18.5); Wed, 25 Dec 2019 02:14:47 +0000 X-MC-Relay: Neutral X-MailChannels-SenderId: dreamhost|x-authsender|jurta@jurta.org X-MailChannels-Auth-Id: dreamhost X-Abortive-Average: 1c7fbd1b4dc4309d_1577240086901_3180786659 X-MC-Loop-Signature: 1577240086901:2389136483 X-MC-Ingress-Time: 1577240086900 Original-Received: from pdx1-sub0-mail-a50.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx1-sub0-mail-a50.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EECC37F078; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 18:14:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=linkov.net; h=from:to:cc :subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-type; s=linkov.net; bh=y26u0Drzd99voApxdJ8Wwv6MAgI=; b= VahNbh4XWHGWLORiYOSntN5LaGtWhsRho9qPtyW5+Mg4VbIvZKaZyjil6IvkC2b9 Kasl5M5B3K8EB2zqqJbIZQZiLJGyUGZrmLYghnylRjfhVmnnzJrvXshy3R+vHY8o EPXLxM7LCR397067JcDQyYT7+YpENzmuSao4RAf6x4k= Original-Received: from mail.jurta.org (m91-129-107-186.cust.tele2.ee [91.129.107.186]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jurta@jurta.org) by pdx1-sub0-mail-a50.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 00C8D7F077; Tue, 24 Dec 2019 18:14:38 -0800 (PST) X-DH-BACKEND: pdx1-sub0-mail-a50 In-Reply-To: <83lfr1wxo6.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:28:09 +0200") X-VR-OUT-STATUS: OK X-VR-OUT-SCORE: -100 X-VR-OUT-SPAMCAUSE: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrvddvvddgudeglecutefuodetggdotefrodftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfftffgtefojffquffvnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenucfjughrpefhvffuohhfffgjkfgfgggtsehttdertddtredtnecuhfhrohhmpefluhhrihcunfhinhhkohhvuceojhhurhhisehlihhnkhhovhdrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpeifihhkihhpvgguihgrrdhorhhgnecukfhppeeluddruddvledruddtjedrudekieenucfrrghrrghmpehmohguvgepshhmthhppdhhvghlohepmhgrihhlrdhjuhhrthgrrdhorhhgpdhinhgvthepledurdduvdelrddutdejrddukeeipdhrvghtuhhrnhdqphgrthhhpefluhhrihcunfhinhhkohhvuceojhhurhhisehlihhnkhhovhdrnhgvtheqpdhmrghilhhfrhhomhepjhhurhhisehlihhnkhhovhdrnhgvthdpnhhrtghpthhtohepvghlihiisehgnhhurdhorhhgnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 23.83.209.45 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:243622 Archived-At: > Can you tell more about the plan? Web browsers support the officially registered URI scheme 'about' to reveal internal state and built-in functions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/About_URI_scheme There is one 'about' URI, namely 'about:protocols' already implemented in Emacs in lisp/url/url-about.el Then why not to support more 'about' URIs like: about:memory - with data returned from 'garbage-collect' about:processes about:timers about:buffers etc. If it's worth going that path, then would it be nice also to browse docstrings in eww as well with such URI as e.g. about:function/cdr There is one problem that some links might require executing Lisp code, e.g. to visit C source code. In this case where Web browsers execute JavaScript, use Emacs-specific EMACScript: Click to visit C source code or C source code > For example, the following questions seem to be pertinent: > > . why implement this as part of eww? Emacs is not a browser, which > can only react to protocols, it has other ways of interaction Because eww provides basic capabilities present in web browsers such as rendering the standard HTML format and using hypertext links for navigation. OTOH, I think it would be useful only for browsing, not for interaction: it would not make sense to implement so-called "web apps" to be able to e.g. mark and delete buffers in the buffer list displayed in eww - this would be an inappropriate thing to do. > . where will all the HTML content come from? will it be taken from > the existing documentation or written from scratch? HTML content will be generated by functions like the existing 'url-about-protocols' in lisp/url/url-about.el. These functions might extract data from various data sources, including docstrings. > . eww is not very sophisticated browser, so are you sure displaying > HTML with it will be significantly better than "semi-obsolete" > Info? Many features of the Info browser are already supported in eww such as search and next/prev page navigation. But eww could be extended further with capabilities of the Info browser. > . more generally, what will be the advantages of providing > documentation this way, as opposed to the way we provide it now? Advantages: - consistent unified UI for browsing Emacs internals and documentation; - browser-like navigation using links where every resource is represented by standardized URI scheme; - navigation history shared between various resources including Help and Info; - easy bookmarking of every available resource; ...