From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Lift {global,local}-key-binding to Lisp Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 16:10:59 +0000 Message-ID: <87lfcrzgq4.fsf@tcd.ie> References: <83zh1cbpua.fsf@gnu.org> <00a56206-80a0-c2c5-5247-d6be21fea5c0@yandex.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1074"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Dmitry Gutov , Stefan Kangas , Leo Liu , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" To: Christopher Miles Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 17 17:11:40 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1l1AeS-0000CM-LE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 17:11:40 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37862 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l1AeR-0005Hq-H6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 11:11:39 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56306) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l1Adt-0004pV-En for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 11:11:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-wr1-x433.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::433]:35374) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l1Adr-00055R-NS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 11:11:05 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-wr1-x433.google.com with SMTP id l12so8917140wry.2 for ; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 08:11:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tcd-ie.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=0zEVT9eDLC63N3klk3ysHHELKqPrUmCaqC+bQrB1Oc8=; b=sXG4PcCvuPHovKXRiJuxzRyqrxPcAye9IE5fy3wgRPmfhSvGbp10SdcmCmy0Chb8Je 37fUskNWP4qK/OBGm9NqmmaGeLfrZ24IDZpsTPwgB87qtq6BUGWPOzQtFZBobURe8dhK JsDxLp2M9qEevGQAqaLqxQqzQreuFpRBX5ANY7mChKZy8BE/36gKHZv5kLdqlNwP+Few V8QkO2PBEipPCgnJj5aMod5b03TcKKk/Sv9qB0WO+qvHpCSm9oI15ivPqy2WmEKzO6xO An1Dx1R37T22IJGS6Nkb5FNz4nOXFBB8DJFGxY483N/AnIrVYtlJBCLAAbHXzDLNBp5Z M7Ng== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=0zEVT9eDLC63N3klk3ysHHELKqPrUmCaqC+bQrB1Oc8=; b=VCDSo4eWqN2NZ34169L4NN27gUDDO6rNeilkosCVEvIsqJ211jSchtyIxE6gjfgbvz 1layHTGIihC829e/SjTxVYZIxYmntNtVhFu3oOgMtgmzogADpJjJb5grQVfFB+iBcKhy PagEGH5FuQ/Fx9/H16yMojmFJ4HWLUEqJuLzjVKdlv02T4Z4wRLlLUYFg0VmQMVLRqlk dq8ofkdh0lKbHhOW+MkZV9i/sN2wK6scDeP451A1zxXTFTeshx8Ucv6+ZuOve8cnr8xf uBE1MJ+uHQgO14I6UZsVd7g2Ro+OFSFKmId7le3cKhBYnfpTwK7O4JqHcKapgouRC3bV QLxA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533hicdhx2hyb42jzb7pANU2UPPU9zH9kPV00suwDvOslG9Hh6bG 9R5CeMnW9HxcI4Wm1LZBtK5m/Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwcDRcF8qXKys8xNNJ7S85vPKYrTOilNc1Ov8itnBNOqH8vyQrjcGyViM+xwJVtYVR2K7GpHQ== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:1d0:: with SMTP id t16mr22191372wrx.203.1610899862180; Sun, 17 Jan 2021 08:11:02 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from localhost ([2a02:8084:20e2:c380:f410:82e8:3a21:eedf]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v11sm23602787wrt.25.2021.01.17.08.11.01 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 17 Jan 2021 08:11:01 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: (Christopher Miles's message of "Sun, 17 Jan 2021 14:33:05 +0000") Received-SPF: none client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::433; envelope-from=contovob@tcd.ie; helo=mail-wr1-x433.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:263132 Archived-At: Christopher Miles writes: > Leo Liu writes: > >> On 2021-01-15 14:09 +0200, Dmitry Gutov wrote: >>> Consider that, when a piece of code is implemented in Lisp, it's >>> easier for us "mere mortals" to find it, read, understand and debug >>> it. Even more so when it comes to people outside of emacs-devel. >> >> Eli is not against more elisp. In fact he encourages it. >> >> His principle is for C code that has been there for decades and is _not_ >> broken let us be cautious and make a clear case before moving it to >> elisp. >> >> There could only be good things following this principle. > > If don't move this, then there is same reason to don't more others. Then don't > change any C code which existed for a long time. So the result is don't touch > any C code.... A reason like existing for decade time is not a reasonable > argument. Should talking technically. > > An old house existing for decades, should not update it.... because it exists > decades. We should talk about why update it. And Dmitry Gutov and Stefa gives > clear reason. But you didn't give technical reason. So I think it's not really > arguing correctly. Really should stop this. You seem to have misunderstood - the argument isn't to never touch old C code; it's to not touch it for superficial changes alone, for some definition of superficial. Updating old code for necessary reasons is always welcome. -- Basil