From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Merging native-comp and pgtk Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2021 15:58:45 +0100 Message-ID: <87lfbsovyy.fsf@gnus.org> References: <07D5E64D-DAD0-45B3-B272-627A73D7CBAE@gmail.com> <87wnvlecrw.fsf@gnus.org> <83sg69o3av.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtwhctte.fsf@gnus.org> <459A0475-E3E7-4159-82DF-93809CCF1E24@gmail.com> <87eehng52n.fsf@gnus.org> <87mtwbye5b.fsf@gmail.com> <87czx7ycva.fsf@tcd.ie> <87eehmyalr.fsf@gmail.com> <877dneoewi.fsf@tcd.ie> <875z2yy6z7.fsf@gmail.com> <878s7twq2t.fsf@gmail.com> <84adc238-c424-bb6b-da28-c4232172da5b@gmx.at> <87wnvcrze8.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1588"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Andrea Corallo , "Andrea Corallo via Emacs development discussions." To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 13 15:59:37 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lAwOW-0000JY-Ox for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 15:59:36 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52292 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAwOV-0008CA-Rv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 09:59:35 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:39328) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAwNr-0007hm-OP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 09:58:55 -0500 Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([2a01:4f9:2b:f0f::2]:39542) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lAwNq-0003pG-2s for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 09:58:55 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=3DuDOy4NZ++2O8pjeIggAOpZmSo+33cOOxhI1YB44Ik=; b=md8x5BGBasHGCFlg9UMlekBL0S HKfgfhCrWUfS1QDM5LmO/6jsj7NoScQy7WrjZXqQy5F58dYKsDTTYDt4wi33khT1yQG4ynnDp/QVd b5XsCzvI29Ym7s2ipmpx2gqL2nMA0n5W6QlSIlg2YLOayNoECQKmoMefsmJXcFeNCV/o=; Original-Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lAwNi-0006Wt-FV; Sat, 13 Feb 2021 15:58:49 +0100 Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAJFBMVEWMa0mOemSXmWhx g0RrZk3S0LNcUzhGNiwnHRk2KyWDXzz////YFlUIAAAAAWJLR0QLH9fEwAAAAAd0SU1FB+UCDQ4u BuoNKj8AAADNSURBVDjL7ZA9CsJAEIU3/iBYqWAvk6wHUA8gYmG9ZK0FJWJn5SYXMJNOQbKztzWW OnMABb/yffse7Kho+MZgBDN4oT6BeL4Cs+AiTvbN+ykX7bgpaDNhopMlK6MtF2qdAGjDc9WCBISl hhGAmP8+wwOIeQ/dQxQn52gnCXd07izkHV9cfM3z1tbnzhOv6LSkOlDJhE2rcAlUcbENZUEoiBSR CIUpg5UXRF9bwoB4ZY2uzbFAvPGP2LxyiEsuxptm6i6cJJrW60z9+U6iJ1pEOZ4NtRAfAAAAJXRF WHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIxLTAyLTEzVDE0OjQ2OjA2KzAwOjAwQs/GbQAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpt b2RpZnkAMjAyMS0wMi0xM1QxNDo0NjowNiswMDowMDOSftEAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: Nettle's _Unciviliz_: "Ensamblaje" In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Sat, 13 Feb 2021 08:41:45 -0500") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a01:4f9:2b:f0f::2; envelope-from=larsi@gnus.org; helo=quimby.gnus.org X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:264632 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: > There are some important differences between compiling to byte-code and > compiling to native-code: > > - Compiling to byte-code is not transparent. The resulting code may > behave differently in the two cases, there are questions like > `load-prefer-newer`, the compilation itself is useful to get feedback > via warnings (or even failures), the compilation can also have all > kinds of side-effects (like an `eval-when-compile` which triggers > compilation of something else...), the `load-history` will tell you > which of .el or .elc you loaded, ... .eln isn't fully transparent either -- you get different backtraces etc from compiled code than byte-compiled code, for instance. > - Compilation of byte-code is fast. That's the main point for not switching it on, I guess. > - Byte-code enjoys backward compatibility. Very limited backwards compatibility -- we've introduced new byte codes in Emacs 28, for instance. It's not a goal, but when it happens it's nice. Byte-code enjoys sideways compatibility, though -- one can use the same .elc files on both ARM and AMD systems, but that's definitely not true for .eln files. But... I'm not sure that's much of a consideration either -- the rest of Emacs has to be built for a specific architecture, so... > None of those apply to native-code compilation. On an under-powered > machine like a BananaPi byte-code compilation of the whole of Emacs > takes quite a while (order of magnitude around 1h). It's a pain but > it's bearable. For native-code compilation the order of magnitude is > a whole day, which I don't find bearable, especially since all those > .eln files need to be rebuilt as soon as I have recompiled a new > `temacs`! Oh, they have to be? I didn't know that. Why? :-) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no