From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: base Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:18:49 +0900 Message-ID: <87k4na4vfq.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <20100822120642.GA1794@muc.de> <87hbij6hib.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87k4nf7ezq.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <878w3v7dd2.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <83wrrfmljv.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3t75crc.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87fwy2g7i2.fsf@telefonica.net> <83r5hmmrz0.fsf@gnu.org> <877hjefll8.fsf@telefonica.net> <83mxsam5lh.fsf@gnu.org> <87eidm5a0n.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87pqx5ec72.fsf@telefonica.net> <87lj7te8qp.fsf@telefonica.net> <87tymg4o2n.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <877hjcdw6q.fsf@telefonica.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1283010656 884 80.91.229.12 (28 Aug 2010 15:50:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2010 15:50:56 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar?= Fuentes Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 28 17:50:53 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OpNgC-0007n8-Jr for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Aug 2010 17:50:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40123 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OpNXP-0001cV-FY for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Aug 2010 11:41:47 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=56653 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OpNXF-0001XX-Dz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Aug 2010 11:41:38 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OpNXE-0006Jh-3Y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Aug 2010 11:41:37 -0400 Original-Received: from [130.158.254.170] (port=50926 helo=dmail01.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OpNXD-0006Iw-K7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Aug 2010 11:41:36 -0400 Original-Received: from imss12.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp (unknown [130.158.254.130]) by dmail01.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 109E8F4C7C for ; Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:23:02 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from imss12.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp (imss12.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp [127.0.0.1]) by postfix.imss70 (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD78FF4003; Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:22:51 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from mgmt1.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (unknown [130.158.97.223]) by imss12.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFC45F4002; Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:22:51 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp [130.158.99.156]) by mgmt1.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDDC13FA0287; Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:22:51 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: by uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 87AEA1A47CA; Sun, 29 Aug 2010 00:18:49 +0900 (JST) In-Reply-To: <877hjcdw6q.fsf@telefonica.net> X-Mailer: VM undefined under 21.5 (beta29) "garbanzo" ed3b274cc037 XEmacs Lucid (x86_64-unknown-linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:129340 Archived-At: =D3scar Fuentes writes: > "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: >=20 > [snip] >=20 > > > On the long term (or not so long) it is not the most > > > cost-effective approach. > > For the users described above, it probably is. That's why Bazaar > > is reasonably popular among people who are project managers in > > companies. They choose one of the well-supported workflows (many > > of which are rather centralized, which often suits managers), the > > users learn it easily because Bazaar makes it easy, and life is > > good. Nothing wrong with that. > Apart from using a sub-optimal tool, right? We're not talking about tools here, we're talking about workflows and use cases. > > But many users will *never* want to do either of those. > [snip] >=20 > Seeing the user as someone with simplistic expectations and needs > is a capital sin in the Emacs religion. Please. I advocate sharp tools and learning how to use them well, too. All I'm saying is that for many users, they will not need that, and should be allowed to learn about the tool at their own pace. Some git users will never need more than "clone", "pull", and "log" (eg, that's my use case for my X.org repos to date). Other users will need more advanced uses, and I think it is a responsibility of those who discuss project workflows to be familiar with them.