From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Proposal: Forwards-Compatibility Library for Emacs Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2021 06:48:30 +0000 Message-ID: <87k0j9qf5t.fsf@posteo.net> References: <877dfavmzw.fsf@posteo.net> <87czp2c6qd.fsf@gnus.org> <87o88lr63i.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1799"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 22 08:51:02 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mSw5u-0000Ej-BM for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 08:51:02 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58010 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mSw5s-00044q-E8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 02:51:00 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58394) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mSw3c-0002Mw-BB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 02:48:40 -0400 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:54591) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mSw3a-0003B1-1M for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 02:48:39 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E62BD240029 for ; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 08:48:33 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1632293313; bh=5sIOqNxx31G2XjOZhQ/tznIKjtq1JBi06kVb1A1Wq8M=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:From; b=YtMxy+fKIm3rO6GVEJS94JGXacGjnwiS5LTwSFRGgx7Us5uPyeNStJOVChqFp68SN SOSLPhQfYzl2bsNNYKDJFRfyZ7MI3MSHkQZi02DP2oTleG7Gi1I4+na7ZitJLUdkdA sGmPCf4vvbUs+BL/tEOAj3++JSrhv5YLonW9VHA6Fo5iLILx3/jF/Nv+FwhsRt8jjF zYy3WqJzKO7qoC9D9QzyBHHpCzWWV9RiDERuzsnLGGMWzEpbmvUkI6Yz7ZFcmGGAXX SmubX4ioZbPnTZmMdztMY0obZPdlZrU+HKIcGF29qlJZ5Rf7QSPHFJpWuZJp0M+061 I1D7zUIaLfFBw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4HDpm074Gwz9rxR; Wed, 22 Sep 2021 08:48:32 +0200 (CEST) Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEYHHqUhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAp3GdmYJ6tm5McweY6dEvIYIiry+Oz9rU4MH6NHWK0Ee0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiQBBMWCAA4FiEEDM2H44ZoPt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJ CAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQtVrAHPRh1FyTkgEAjlbGPxFchvMbxzAES3r8QLuZgCxeAXunM9gh io0ePtUBALVhh9G6wIoZhl0gUCbQpoN/UJHI08Gm1qDob5zDxnIHuDgEYHHqUhIKKwYBBAGXVQEF AQEHQNcRB+MUimTMqoxxMMUERpOR+Q4b1KgncDZkhrO2ql1tAwEIB4h4BBgWCAAgFiEEDM2H44Zo Pt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwwACgkQtVrAHPRh1Fw1JwD/Qo7kvtib8jy7puyWrSv0MeTS g8qIxgoRWJE/KKdkCLEA/jb9b9/g8nnX+UcwHf/4VfKsjExlnND3FrBviXUW6NcB In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Tue, 21 Sep 2021 17:50:52 -0400") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:275292 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >> I am not sure how this would help provide forwards compatibility for >> older versions? Are you proposing that instead of using >> file-name-concat, libraries use compat28-file-name-concat that is >> defined in a library for older versions? > > Yes. > >> My intuition would be that this wouldn't be worth the effort, seeing as >> most people would probably hesitate to use such long names. > > If the function is important enough that the author would otherwise make > its own local function, then I think they'd be happy to use that > slightly longer name rather than having their own local definition. > > If not, then it's probably just as well if they simply don't use it > (and that should avoid having the compatibility library accrue > too many definitions of too little value). This I'd describe as compatibility for convenience, but there are also examples where core ELPA implement general algorithms and functionality that could be used elsewhere too (project--buffers-to-kill and project--kill-buffer-check were mentioned as one example last year). But they cannot be factored out, because that would raise the minimal required version. The complementary example are external packages that hesitate to use newer functionality, for the same reason (I already gave the example of the second optional "interactive" argument). The infrastructure may not exist, but for anyone before Emacs 28, this could just be ignored away, while newer users get to keep it. > Stefan > -- Philip Kaludercic