From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: contributing to Emacs Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2023 12:54:56 +0200 Message-ID: <87jzw1doma.fsf@web.de> References: <83v8fnslfz.fsf@gnu.org> <87v8fnh1h2.fsf@web.de> <83mt0zs9rc.fsf@gnu.org> <0a968a4e1b267c0f15dd237e6ea12a709fc06d5e.camel@yandex.ru> <838rcisj7o.fsf@gnu.org> <6537fa5fa5c1fe8437ed99ee0988e35895f5a54b.camel@yandex.ru> <8423a35750d8d8e0437c7708f6b4d0bbdfdb7fe0.camel@yandex.ru> <87o7ldf7ky.fsf@web.de> <8cc19084ab18d0adb0f2cee4af14aa1b1d914a83.camel@yandex.ru> <83sfapnl57.fsf@gnu.org> <83pm5tnk78.fsf@gnu.org> <73cbe80096cd97728fcdaccf9f9badeea606570b.camel@yandex.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="29146"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: mu4e 1.10.2; emacs 29.0.90 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , ams@gnu.org, luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Konstantin Kharlamov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jun 18 12:58:16 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qAq6q-0007OV-44 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 18 Jun 2023 12:58:16 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qAq6J-0002mL-EO; Sun, 18 Jun 2023 06:57:43 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qAq6H-0002kK-5O for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Jun 2023 06:57:41 -0400 Original-Received: from mout.web.de ([212.227.17.11]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qAq6E-0001yj-Ag; Sun, 18 Jun 2023 06:57:40 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=web.de; s=s29768273; t=1687085854; x=1687690654; i=arne_bab@web.de; bh=RKA/X6I4tqryT385sXh3VoMUluKJQYIg4/10hdkLkXs=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:References:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:In-reply-to; b=wrDLCGPU0DGyIWkVbyD5maW+rg97WllT+g0hk85+GX66rl++Bmy+6n8PaNqWOR9PR5uoJzw b4omVnJM6IUNY7Q11SZqn7SzgfYEKZbdkRyYP7V5rsildsqukJsMWOMB+9Gg8WDTswu2Jvp55 FuLIJZ3Jsg5shFW8ejVd8rttrnk74FzFQV1+p4vr2JPiBXNSWVkThcEV+Saza9PqrHERFW9gX OU6W8Y+dcTljMBcAWdfmywkra+sa0hgrv/VKVdK9ombQvR/6V0xyGLIvw+696pOULnhutbUFc Rv5RR+3n/aoso/RRGvmJNuSLRCfi3a7euxtes0JWikWpB4BS4Vbw== X-UI-Sender-Class: 814a7b36-bfc1-4dae-8640-3722d8ec6cd6 Original-Received: from fluss ([84.165.25.222]) by smtp.web.de (mrweb106 [213.165.67.124]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MSIJ0-1qYwZ40xxo-00ShzD; Sun, 18 Jun 2023 12:57:34 +0200 In-reply-to: <73cbe80096cd97728fcdaccf9f9badeea606570b.camel@yandex.ru> X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:zD2RKrEB0a36uSMJmD2/amE3FwVhBBiNwE9THqDVBiOEL0NTZsX 0W1usats421gr8fNUSQO9R79VxycmvuJYgimchQVUJvqx777S8bDHaKTP4h5JbpzAtQf43Z /pHFI/sNuTuf3YnCAW1rKv5hvb8Cy14ATM2B1PUz53mk5qJWIN6sdzlTe7mckLZUo8nkA0D WUo40UOGtq4/CtLOqRXKA== UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:3mm9VqHc9HQ=;cg7jwlerr36AKD6xcBYc9oVdXAS 17VKPze6e6JYAuy9C7nH6jjPIFflz9swfojC5Ikgj5T9DbBHNRP6KsYl6+qY3GMLCMYi8Z2Lx mCAl6R/AZHh7Y2NXJKiTd17/z9VAb72Lx6IVWTSmCoMqZTB915tmDSTGmnezzZKuMo1tsk1Fl +NKZJ8akTRX2/V7HCLsYSx9wXHMMjX6UWnAZ27cl5i2NzVL/cjX/I3VYC5icQQvV56vLI/5y4 cwv6zzrH1Z18GIb6gxEa9lYLLjWa7kz8qV6z98bRoPwriIqW9jB2OOB3xHiVoYIXBBwqnLK6G vEZw3FiFXPYPTiIL/4A6ZF896oLT4oKcy2CqbRbIuhO1HJBKE9GJ7xwki0bcHJyv4yYU3HQHQ R4BDxTfBNaL5ccb7xOECrFZWCDrKZSBwObwQFbJihLAj0lf3txnxN04S59tyyVwxDbqfRw0y8 gk/D0RenlJIiG9OgTryrZQnyNq6WzkZF/qRxO7e3csenT60RxQPGw15xg0om1dyKMLbAQ8PeV dwwhc4bj/QpOQ7vXVZtRMR1chltrmrnLhlrIi2WWod4JIpZHRkDgjJhT0YTvGn/xS0jyMjRy9 +jDNhFL764XQKyxlP64vlcJSJYMTRR4OrkNKbB+mnSWSUITcVx4yLJUZaJcTmYcA/oWZ32beQ 5D9OlMGyLhxPZN89pIdqhlTGTI310VXiWccoOnXxttjaGdIsV75amhcFk8SiK4oc5JLYMO8aP sjjd/oINU/dg0l2QrgArsCw0jwPJ9uWFjFApbnI8UmAn/Y6tGVSolcJZKc3BcW1XGAYEL0p6 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.17.11; envelope-from=arne_bab@web.de; helo=mout.web.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:306961 Archived-At: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Konstantin Kharlamov writes: > On Sun, 2023-06-18 at 13:22 +0300, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> > From: Konstantin Kharlamov >> > Cc: arne_bab@web.de, ams@gnu.org, luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.= org >> > Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2023 13:13:23 +0300 >> >=20 >> > On Sun, 2023-06-18 at 13:02 +0300, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> > > > From: Konstantin Kharlamov >> > > > Cc: "Alfred M. Szmidt" , eliz@gnu.org, luangruo@yahoo= .com,=20 >> > > > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0emacs-devel@gnu.org >> > > > Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2023 12:56:33 +0300 >> > > >=20 >> > > > Okay, so, here's an obvious one: a patch series sent to >> > > > bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org >> > > > should not create separate bugreports for every patch. >> > > >=20 >> > > > In ML-managed projects it is typical to send patches as a series, = and >> > > > when >> > > > you >> > > > doing that results in such surprising behaviour, it creates an >> > > > additional >> > > > emotional and mental load both for you and for maintainers who wou= ld >> > > > need to >> > > > do >> > > > something with these separate reports. >> > >=20 >> > > Our preference is to send patches as a single patch, not as patch >> > > series. >> > >=20 >> > > That said, people are sometimes sending series, and we don't ask them >> > > to resend, we process those series anyway. >> > >=20 >> > > As for separate bug reports, this is easily fixed by merging them. >> >=20 >> > Unfortunately merging bugreports does not fix that. The last patch I h= ad to >> > Emacs was sent with a cover letter and resulted in two reports: one fo= r the >> > cover letter and another for the patch itself. You may remember that it >> > resulted >> > in a confusion, because =CE=B1) discussions happened on both threads, = but then a >> > new >> > patch version was only sent to one of them, so there other thread wasn= 't >> > notified that comments were addressed, and =CE=B2) you may remember 3 = months >> > after >> > the patch got accepted someone was asking the status. Which is because= one >> > of >> > the threads was closed saying that the patch is applied, but then the = other >> > thread into which a person was looking has no such comment. >> >=20 >> > > So I see no problem here. >> >=20 >> > This is psychology. Having a report per patch may not be a problem for= you, >> > but >> > when a contributor sends patches and gets into such situation, they do= not >> > know >> > it is okay. They will be frightened and frustrated, because it looks l= ike >> > something just went wrong. Such situation being okay needs at least be >> > mentioned >> > in "sending patches" section, and at best it should just work. >>=20 >> Like I said: we prefer a single patch for each changeset.=C2=A0 The >> problems presented by patch series are one reason.=C2=A0 And yet, we will >> never reject a patch series, even though it makes the process >> inconvenient and confusing. >>=20 >> I don't see what else do we need to argued about here. > > Well, you see, the "sending patches" section has no mention that a series= is > unwelcome. And Emacs is the unique project where a squashed patch with ma= ny > commits is preferred over a series. There is "When you have all these pieces, bundle them up in a mail message and send it to the developers."=C2=B9 which to me implies to send a single email. But it can easily get missed in the long text (datapoint for that: you missed it), that=E2=80=99s why I think the text shown to new contributors s= hould get changed. =C2=B9: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Sending-P= atches.html Best wishes, Arne =2D-=20 Unpolitisch sein hei=C3=9Ft politisch sein, ohne es zu merken. draketo.de --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJEBAEBCAAuFiEE801qEjXQSQPNItXAE++NRSQDw+sFAmSO4x0QHGFybmVfYmFi QHdlYi5kZQAKCRAT741FJAPD61yNEACXE5tY6/sWLgLk6+BepW/a4vU9+jLFn+U/ wT6W5nlu4xJLL7YjufjwdnfaJR5Er9B35QsoEchz8FCEvpJjkqcyiHrbhblm0cMz K8Lx/LIA/c/eo3uPTfUCqCF0PAOExmqsf5qvLJibfRC27XB52/Xl18IteNxnJQLh 3c6U10+Wi483nxWe+AZaXsCzypG/ObAkEQx/KDVgV5Kp4bmPG7MKfJmCqVMKwF6P zMULuSGpqjIu/aROWSRK4+lldnaTjZJOc5i8Ie2lmx2SNmq/h3T/HoM+fVWZV1Wv 8fYMuFOwsyOgDKWozKj/ZSod10Rgejcgo7PfLGhQ/7XYhqyTODyJHHKPwXe/4H6Z evwKzRWs4NwIuceI4zeulRLKpIj5gO9O+Rzs8sxaaca4YX1VozCFEzSnnQKwwDx1 dir4ivo3nZhydG5fJnb/4BbpKcEt+ewn1vcEjMVr07SVcG92dNEaDo9HzH7I4rGf cbZ1BBrbPghHwpE26qM/0+4BwZhc1HHtxAR8OzG20e4jKq9hKL84S0aZ5OH76FJq Cea7TBXgQlxGhmyAcrd/Gmcd12sex8Of5G+dT5OlXOt61BwJ5rQbz6eYJ9nONJe3 q1VDBZMVeQXUj1KDqXyI13MZQCWgvm1tkuvp7Y0hyuMtNfA5TpcvcxfxPdabXjJY si3DdwSNhIjEBAEBCAAuFiEE3Si95tmHXKvOSosd3M8NswvBBUgFAmSO4x0QHGFy bmVfYmFiQHdlYi5kZQAKCRDczw2zC8EFSPyjA/9FF1VMzlxzJ3m98ydq4C/bzBkr dQF8RpxGe6590pdxxo/htpbCvcy0C4qJVJwQa/KcQn/FUcmTWdz1J39X8QLGp0cj OdoC3gxJOvP79rpX89ZVH6UgA40/tvEipRQNcyqKrdB/P8GnyMeIK1fLMx3Rnj0D Jqg7HEQG25ATBBGL9Q== =u4eU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--