From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juri Linkov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Info enhancements Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2003 03:27:37 +0200 Organization: JURTA Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <87isku20s6.fsf@mail.jurta.org> References: <878ylrbbk4.fsf@mail.jurta.org> <200312051827.hB5IRfk17741@f7.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1070674661 32623 80.91.224.253 (6 Dec 2003 01:37:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2003 01:37:41 +0000 (UTC) Cc: bob@rattlesnake.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 06 02:37:37 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1ASRO5-0004iv-00 for ; Sat, 06 Dec 2003 02:37:37 +0100 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1ASRO5-0006zu-00 for ; Sat, 06 Dec 2003 02:37:37 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1ASSJi-0001Bk-TL for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 21:37:10 -0500 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1ASSHY-0000ft-SX for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 21:34:56 -0500 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1ASSH2-0000aw-Is for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 21:34:55 -0500 Original-Received: from [64.246.52.22] (helo=ns5.tangramltd.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.24) id 1ASSH2-0000Zr-3O for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 21:34:24 -0500 Original-Received: from 80-235-35-6-dsl.mus.estpak.ee ([80.235.35.6] helo=mail.jurta.org) by ns5.tangramltd.com with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASRJZ-0000Z1-0e; Sat, 06 Dec 2003 03:32:57 +0200 Original-To: karl@freefriends.org (Karl Berry) In-Reply-To: <200312051827.hB5IRfk17741@f7.net> (Karl Berry's message of "Fri, 5 Dec 2003 13:27:41 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.1003 (Gnus v5.10.3) Emacs/21.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ns5.tangramltd.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - jurta.org X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:18451 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:18451 karl@freefriends.org (Karl Berry) writes: > As for the xref stuff, I am not at all sure the second arg to xref > should be treated in a special way; that was not its original intent and > nothing has ever been documented about it. I didn't know standalone > info did any searching based on it. I'll have to think about that. > > I can see that making index entries automatically be xrefable points > could be useful, in a few circumstances. But that is a separate feature > from handling entries in the indexes themselves, so that the menu > entries there go to the right place. > > Luc, my own personal opinion is that the conditional > file-coding-system-alist xref should be deleted as you were going to > do. If it's in the same section, users shouldn't need an xref (or else > the section should be split, but the section in question seems a > reasonable length to me). I agree that references to another part of the same small Info node is useless. I used this particular section as an example of enhancements. But there are many other places in Info documentation where better references to index entries are needed. For instance, let's consider the following excerpt from the Emacs Lisp Manual: See also `append' in *Note Building Lists::, `concat' in *Note Creating Strings::, and `vconcat' in *Note Vectors::, for other ways to copy sequences. Such kind of references has at least two big drawbacks: 1. Users see too much unimportant information such as node names. With using function names in reference names users will see only function names, i.e. only what they need. Nodes names will be hidden: See also append, concat, and vconcat for other ways to copy sequences. 2. When a reference contains only a node name, then after going to this node user should manually locate a place where needed function is described. Note that nodes `Building Lists' and `Creating Strings' are very large, so user must spend a significant amount of time to locate this place. With using index entries as reference names, this tedious task will be performed automatically. There are two variants of writing index names in references: See also *Note append: Building Lists, *Note concat: Creating Strings, and *Note vconcat: Vectors, for other ways to copy sequences. or references to anchors: See also *Note append::, *Note concat::, and *Note vconcat::, for other ways to copy sequences. I believe this enhancement can easily be done with the existing Info format. -- http://www.jurta.org/emacs/