From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel,gmane.emacs.bbdb.user Subject: Re: Adding BBDB 3 core to Emacs Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 10:04:31 +0100 Message-ID: <87io4t6q8w.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <82mvuffcyc.fsf@jobim-via-gmail.com> <45822.7509.289752.22092@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <64270.20127.528598.22095@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <837flb46rd.fsf@gnu.org> <52708.83016.592199.22096@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <22097.26737.870404.583614@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <57388.42932.894770.22097@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <22097.59862.631373.834781@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <14041.65164.427377.22098@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <22098.28735.18734.396485@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1448271633 23534 80.91.229.3 (23 Nov 2015 09:40:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 09:40:33 +0000 (UTC) Cc: John Wiegley , Roland Winkler , bbdb-info@lists.sourceforge.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Nov 23 10:40:19 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1a0nbP-0000op-9B for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 10:40:03 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59550 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a0nbP-00007H-Hh for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 04:40:03 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42722) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a0naz-0008Uz-JH for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 04:39:38 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a0nav-0001eU-MN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 04:39:37 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:33644) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a0nau-0001dZ-3E; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 04:39:32 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47457 helo=lola) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1a0nas-0006pX-Px; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 04:39:31 -0500 Original-Received: by lola (Postfix, from userid 1000) id A2FF4DF933; Mon, 23 Nov 2015 10:04:31 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <22098.28735.18734.396485@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> (Stephen J. Turnbull's message of "Mon, 23 Nov 2015 10:47:43 +0900") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:195100 gmane.emacs.bbdb.user:4126 Archived-At: "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: > Roland Winkler writes: > > On Mon Nov 23 2015 Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > > > > Have you looked at the new code? > > > > > > I don't need to; I trust you that 'most every line has been > > > changed, and many functions completely rewritten. The point is > > > that old configuration works with very little change with the new > > > code. Therefore it stinks of "derivative work" to me. > > > > Your view > > It's not "my view", it's Emacs project policy as designed by Richard > Stallman with the advice of the FSF lawyers. Ask the AUCTeX guys how > picky it gets. :-( The AUCTeX guys did not have problems with reimplementations being tagged as problematic. The principal problem was that we had about a decade of loosely attributed work. We've managed to collect assignments from all the known main contributors and past maintainers and most people with known or unknown contributions (basically mentioned in the "thanks" section but without an actual record, some not even remembering that they should have contributed anything). So we are in "to the best of our knowledge" territory with regard to assignments and fairly sure that we can fill in any potential holes caused by people complaining about AUCTeX's distribution under (c) FSF claims. That was an ugly and ungrateful mess to deal with, but theories of weak or strong derivation did not play into it. Yet. There were a few rewrites from scratch for style files where the original author could no longer be reached or bothered. Those files were basically "flat" with regard to creative content, namely containing no tricky or high-quality code or even any new data structures/algorithms. So with regard to the problem you are talking about, AUCTeX does not really provide any data point either way. > > would never allow a program like libreoffice to come into > > existence. > > It's not what others can do with BBDB code that matters. AFAIK > there's no doubt that it's GPL. What matters is whether the FSF legal > staff can be convinced it's not encumbered by third-party copyrights. I have no knowledge of BBDB myself so I cannot sport an opinion on that. -- David Kastrup