From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Robert Pluim Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: tabulated-list sort icon is reversed Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:17:00 +0200 Message-ID: <87h8kg7nyr.fsf@gmail.com> References: <83a7qbtc6l.fsf@gnu.org> <83bmaqq735.fsf@gnu.org> <8736w1dmqg.fsf@phil.uni-goettingen.de> <9dff1909-16e7-4632-b763-8c809d83fc06@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1532964493 21566 195.159.176.226 (30 Jul 2018 15:28:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 15:28:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org, Philippe Vaucher , Joost Kremers To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jul 30 17:28:08 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fkA5c-0005Mt-Qm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:28:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53255 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fkA7j-0001bt-JT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 11:30:15 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46132) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fk9v3-0000Zq-T1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 11:17:10 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fk9ux-0004K3-RZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 11:17:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wm0-x232.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c09::232]:38993) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fk9ux-0004IY-IW; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 11:17:03 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wm0-x232.google.com with SMTP id h20-v6so64125wmb.4; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 08:17:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-followup-to:mail-copies-to :gmane-reply-to-list:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=st/rcOoqrzdvvJ6qy4zj2zzLrkYbXF0P9aYq8OWEUCc=; b=PNEST/mubDxIr+K62kP33Ys7pOCpxj48KuD5ItrGNJ1p4iPsOcClubmW45EmY/RSBo mZ+QhJC0K+N6dIb5+PgsQ3zqH3MxEKTGG4/ovB09iGYT2OgBDVHiXltxvqQGYY9Zj8cv sh5/y86hfn792zeztUDL/uxnDclZZvIpLNsqCTz0ACAZEAimOMWM0a7CW2UvAFmRBci2 lo4Janz5rLoDkczkQfCN1vXCs9RTF619w5nYwC+dxo3YfNCU88jEmu6o6630tZ7i08rx x8r/OQITsfRDyeUDt4SUR/HNB6QDfcIBkuczu32jJQvaVOOV1/phev/L6lJ+XKrBpnQ/ NlVw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-followup-to :mail-copies-to:gmane-reply-to-list:date:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=st/rcOoqrzdvvJ6qy4zj2zzLrkYbXF0P9aYq8OWEUCc=; b=loH+dRK7GeTM1jJ6tqNd9S67Q7kTsmdUOOvtW55GTqf+YPspaHyfRB47vmlGDzjHMx OJ8+wwtIYvdZscG2lDiUnqSDEbe2wvn/RNKI7zjyFvYNhIC+ZsIiXQi63paRCJ6WDEHi 0b0itNmUlZHPBo/nqezj7F/MXe6SJZ7KFxj0Mx5FxXNUjno0GNyZWzfM4841EX83toTs NAXYTR6FXhyNfOv0G+x58wg6VTxJ/35Z7/fHxE9SeVLVSGpgZTaOCBhu4KbReLgNFYlG 3k6JUbbyEmOHC56RXR6SvprBsr3Uq/zZ4ZpcVeEi+8e8a+YF3ENzq6xnD0TNUgPynOAn 6/dg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOUpUlHBVxSChiUE03g9/RXst5vUaSOAOMz0fo604xC5lf49VT4ScS3C v6oxHMn0q/E9fcLADT5uOD3FvHwHpnQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AAOMgpfKBv0BHHzJR15OEM3qtSuGGUBbQhRnaWSeYmFvhtaeFhORypj/h9Fz1HNuqzBN2iSyM47A+Q== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:6f44:: with SMTP id k65-v6mr15000119wmc.19.1532963822055; Mon, 30 Jul 2018 08:17:02 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from rpluim-ubuntu ([149.5.228.1]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i125-v6sm21147257wmd.23.2018.07.30.08.17.01 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 30 Jul 2018 08:17:01 -0700 (PDT) Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Mail-Copies-To: never Gmane-Reply-To-List: yes In-Reply-To: <9dff1909-16e7-4632-b763-8c809d83fc06@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Mon, 30 Jul 2018 07:48:48 -0700 (PDT)") X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c09::232 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:227998 Archived-At: Drew Adams writes: >> Perhaps it should be noted that Emacs is not alone in using the >> arrow heads this way. The file manager on my Elementary OS system >> (Patheon) uses =E2=96=BC (i.e., a down-pointing triangle) to indicate >> sorting A-Z and 0-9, the Rhythmbox music player does as well, and >> the same goes for the image viewer Geeqie (e.g., in its Exif >> metadata window). >>=20 >> Could be a GNU/Linux vs. Windows / MacOS thing, I don't know. I >> find Emacs' current way of doing things more intuitive, but that's >> just me. I don't think you're ever gonna reach consensus on this >> one. > > It's the case that MS Windows does it the other way around: > ^ means values are currently sorted from low to high (going > down the column). IOW, the triangle _reflects_ the current > sort order - it is a depiction, in a way, of the sorted values. > > To me, that makes more sense. But I agree with this statement: To me it doesn=CA=BCt. It explains why I=CA=BCm always confused and end up having to click at least twice when using Windows. >> But I must also say that I generally only look at these indicators >> to see which column is sorted, not to find out how it's sorted, >> because I find it's quicker (for me) to just look at a few items. > > Still, for some kinds of data looking quickly at the topmost few > values might not be as quick as looking at the column symbol, > once you are used to its meaning. > > If this is mainly (only?) a platform thing then maybe Emacs > should do something different for different platforms - dunno. Please no. One of the fine properties of Emacs is that it generally doesn=CA=BCt vary much between platforms. Robert