From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Why not include all ELPA packages in an Emacs release? Date: Thu, 30 May 2024 15:20:09 +0000 Message-ID: <87h6efuy1i.fsf@posteo.net> References: <87bk4ql3u5.fsf@jeremybryant.net> <864jagu9ji.fsf@gnu.org> <871q5ktxfh.fsf@posteo.net> <878qzrx1cd.fsf@posteo.net> <87r0djlsg5.fsf@daniel-mendler.de> <87zfs7vjw6.fsf@posteo.net> <87frtzium3.fsf@daniel-mendler.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="2487"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Arash Esbati , Eli Zaretskii , Stefan Kangas , jb@jeremybryant.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca To: Daniel Mendler Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu May 30 17:21:18 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1sChag-0000R4-3S for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 May 2024 17:21:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sChZp-0000at-TJ; Thu, 30 May 2024 11:20:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sChZh-0000Xt-Tn for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 May 2024 11:20:19 -0400 Original-Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sChZe-0007NM-93 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 May 2024 11:20:17 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 50B50240105 for ; Thu, 30 May 2024 17:20:11 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1717082411; bh=kgCU7dSAxw2pZlcNt5GjvFAOdCtdgEYEWeCbrhLc5Zk=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:OpenPGP:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From; b=NvOQYb02XmSZNaxk2rVSz5jpBWo8ubJMzoC2xz1wbD+ul2W0hiXyom6DnaTgK5s4N khuf3kFBYkxrwf7lF41wSQVTCEFUHHjUQsso8WqO3XH8KLrdqbQ7IYRfil4mj420qG 4REzQIQT12lkMB5HVRQO2//hk2mFeGbpem2WnT3q/Z2KpApHEbyb4jPyZGt6M6+l+t JYIdT6iX12dBmpJky5IauE+38CWVQZasHy3k10FA6I2OsHnV27VL1XxAmTBG3EvQNp 8Gg3za4iJZUjCPNbtMUnfzOW1cpkChf1StPus9bG1XjYVHG6S0dOX9BvFjsKfjn09L NNy2O39v6sRYg== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4VqqgZ1Fs1z6tlh; Thu, 30 May 2024 17:20:09 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <87frtzium3.fsf@daniel-mendler.de> (Daniel Mendler's message of "Thu, 30 May 2024 10:15:00 +0200") OpenPGP: id=7126E1DE2F0CE35C770BED01F2C3CC513DB89F66; url="https://keys.openpgp.org/vks/v1/by-fingerprint/7126E1DE2F0CE35C770BED01F2C3CC513DB89F66"; preference=signencrypt Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:319756 Archived-At: Daniel Mendler writes: > Philip Kaludercic writes: > >> Daniel Mendler writes: >> >>> Philip Kaludercic writes: >>> >>>> Arash Esbati writes: >>>> >>>>> Philip Kaludercic writes: >>>>> >>>>>> I am not familiar with cape, >>>>> >>>>> Cape offers CAPFs, but I think one great featuzre is that you can swi= tch >>>>> the CAPF function during completion with something like this in your >>>>> init file: >>>>> >>>>> (use-package cape >>>>> :bind (:map corfu-map >>>>> ("C-c p d" . cape-dabbrev) >>>>> ("C-c p f" . cape-file) >>>>> ("C-c p s" . cape-elisp-symbol) >>>>> ("C-c p w" . ispell-completion-at-point) >>>>> ("C-c p :" . cape-emoji))) >>>> >>>> I tried it out, and it doesn't seem to work that well without something >>>> like corfu or vertico. Generally it seems like an example where >>>> "completion" is misinterpreted to mean "selection". >>> >>> This is not correct. Please stop spreading misinformation like this. >>> Capfs like the ones from Cape can be used to complete in a stepwise >>> manner.=20 >> >> I understand that, I am just saying that it doesn't feel that natural >> without something like corfu enabled as well. Or at least with the >> above configuration, something like cape-emoji with the default >> in-buffer completion is less comfortable than the built-in C-x 8 e. >> Same with dabbrev itself vs. cape-dabbrev. > > First, this is not what you said (selection vs completion).=20 I do think that this is related. cape-emoji, cape-tex, etc. do not complete partial input. > Second, the > Capfs provided by Cape work as well or "natural" as other Capfs with the > default completion UI as they do with Corfu. The aforementioned > configuration is meant to trigger completion manually, which will open a > completion UI in any case, but this is not the only way to use these > Cape commands. You can also use the Capfs by adding them to the > `completion-at-point-functions' list. Then you can use them as usual via > `completion-at-point'. Again, I cannot agree or at least I don't see why. My impression is that using the TeX input method remains more natural to me than adding cape-tex to `completion-at-point-functions'. >>> Simple examples are cape-dict, cape-dabbrev or cape-file. >>> cape-dabbrev for example predates the builtin dabbrev-capf and works in >>> the same way. >> >> How? When I use M-/, the expansion is replaced in place, while >> cape-dabbrev behaves more like dabbrev-completion (C-M-/) by prompting >> me for input. > > Yes, dabbrev-expand behaves differently. Note that cape-dabbrev also > replaces the expansion at point if it is unique, like the dabbrev-capf > or dabbrev-completion. But that's not my point here. Cape provides > Capfs, and all I am saying is that the Capfs work as well with the > default completion UI as they do with Corfu. They follow the usual > implementation practices of other Capfs which are already part of Emacs. > You can use them by invoking `completion-at-point' and perform a > step-wise expansion. Selection doesn't has to happen necessarily. I can't think of an example OOTB where completion-at-point expands a string like \alpha results in =CE=B1. When playing around with this, it feels unnatural to me, but if I am the only one who feels like this then this doesn't matter. My point is that this feels less unnatural when used in combination with Corfu, that presents the options as a kind of selection. What is relevant for this thread is that there are (debatable) implicit dependencies between packages that should be kept in mind when considering to add a package to the core. > Daniel --=20 Philip Kaludercic on peregrine