From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: python.el changes in emacs-24 Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:04:48 +0200 Organization: Organization?!? Message-ID: <87fvhryyfz.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <53CE0AF1.7060602@online.de> <53CFCA3B.1010904@cs.ucla.edu> <87wqb3zwid.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87r41bob3h.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87k373zbup.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87ha27ns26.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1406189128 2813 80.91.229.3 (24 Jul 2014 08:05:28 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 08:05:28 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 24 10:05:21 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1g-0003NR-9y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:05:20 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48555 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1f-00032U-Rw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 04:05:19 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:57331) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1X-00030S-6S for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 04:05:17 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1R-0001mo-AZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 04:05:11 -0400 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:57159) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1R-0001ky-53 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 04:05:05 -0400 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XAE1Q-0003Ap-39 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:05:04 +0200 Original-Received: from x2f41a37.dyn.telefonica.de ([2.244.26.55]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:05:04 +0200 Original-Received: from dak by x2f41a37.dyn.telefonica.de with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:05:04 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 32 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: x2f41a37.dyn.telefonica.de X-Face: 2FEFf>]>q>2iw=B6, xrUubRI>pR&Ml9=ao@P@i)L:\urd*t9M~y1^:+Y]'C0~{mAl`oQuAl \!3KEIp?*w`|bL5qr,H)LFO6Q=qx~iH4DN; i"; /yuIsqbLLCh/!U#X[S~(5eZ41to5f%E@'ELIi$t^ Vc\LWP@J5p^rst0+('>Er0=^1{]M9!p?&:\z]|;&=NP3AhB!B_bi^]Pfkw User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.4.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:4fmkqgHh7QgzOVb11Kp042rDgZo= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:173119 Archived-At: "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: > I didn't say it was (nice try at invoking Godwin's Law, by the way). I think that summarizes nicely why we are talking past each other. It is not necessary to look in the past for fascism, the ideology mixing an overimportance of nationality, partially racially/religiously incited superiority complexes, an appeal to fear and national security interests, putting individual freedoms and civil rights behind government interests creating an atmosphere of police and secret police brutality and general unaccountability to the public. You tend to identify things via their labels and rallying cries. When the CIA tortures a dark-skinned person of the wrong religious affiliation to death for fun (the parts of the reports that surfaced already state clearly that the information they were interested in was generally already proferred before they dived in), I am pretty sure that they will not shout "Heil Hitler". But the lack of that particular rallying cry does not change what they are doing and its fundamental incompatibility with what their grandparents fought for in WWII, and the values their ancestors chose to defend and explicate as their own in the 18th century. The Free Software movement is not focused on providing the catchiest rallying cry. That's what the Open Source Movement considers important. And if you want to argue that they got the better one, that might or might not be the case. But if you sell your horse in order to prettify your cart, ultimately you will not be going anywhere but downhill. -- David Kastrup