From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ihor Radchenko Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Debouncing slow mode line constructs (was: Emacs design and architecture. How about copy-on-write?) Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2023 11:36:34 +0000 Message-ID: <87fs37zrjx.fsf@localhost> References: <83fs3ackrq.fsf@gnu.org> <99e84ae7-b3aa-a009-5cb8-a75826343196@gutov.dev> <838r92cgxp.fsf@gnu.org> <837comcam8.fsf@gnu.org> <6946e6f0-c6ef-186c-35d4-c09935c05a07@gutov.dev> <83y1h1axtq.fsf@gnu.org> <87sf79rq5o.fsf@yahoo.com> <83fs38c2yv.fsf@gnu.org> <83o7hw9ee1.fsf@gnu.org> <87il84q845.fsf@yahoo.com> <83il849bx6.fsf@gnu.org> <87a5tfri8c.fsf@yahoo.com> <878r8z27cs.fsf@localhost> <44e98df7-f683-ac07-e644-40757f1d26f9@gutov.dev> <87msxfzts6.fsf@localhost> <7b0c07f5-88c8-4f2c-6ac6-a6112c884f32@gutov.dev> <87il83zsg1.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="18809"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Po Lu , Eli Zaretskii , acm@muc.de, incal@dataswamp.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 21 15:31:27 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qjJmB-0004iK-C2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 15:31:27 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qjJly-0007k0-OT; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 09:31:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qjJle-0007S2-5C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 09:30:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qjJlZ-0007Tc-JY for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 09:30:52 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0F8A8240027 for ; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 13:35:18 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1695296118; bh=SnpOPMi7srNHY6TVYDhy3AAR0KaukJUj3t0pxI5A3gs=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:From; b=h2snaGYqEadeqBVy8jHur/3AnvkRiv3mvmkM/00PtnYGti0llPx6rbj+Wo1Gl4D0D nyT/VFUI0RqfLtsCNN7B6WfyXabT2CnRukpV2oUQKn0ZobhcUUEz9sTNNtzYXkJxZ/ vMw3wsSuTixoI08CbXtFk+fHuY8r0M5Y0ioi6a5maWXqNNlnwaeX2gB+sxy5tAnUR4 scQ86f84SdasZ4QF2+6S21G2HFqvHK3UzgiNaSKj++0wvEA3K4eG9yzq/ywuHCGKbm pFwMFF928iaRtSgvz2gTi5EeU2Y1NWLkEgR6pfxv2zB7yySOIjq5kl42CPTq9WwMnK JO1cPVLo9Gcbw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4RrtcP2mrlz9rxN; Thu, 21 Sep 2023 13:35:17 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:310906 Archived-At: Dmitry Gutov writes: > On 21/09/2023 14:17, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >>> And even the "slow" mode-line packages still manage to maintain at least >>> 5fps, I believe. >> Nope. 0.2 sec is the delay that is barely noticeable. When "slow" >> mode-line packages affect users it is usually much worse than 5fps. >> (Though sometimes it is due to redisplay being fired frequently, not the >> individual refresh times being too large). > > My own experience is finding certain mode-lines that look okay on the > first glance, but then after measuring, finding them to be the chief > contributor to the lower refresh rate. Those might refresh well above > 10fps, but spending 100ms (or even 50ms) on a mode-line is ridiculous. > > Delays which are noticeable by humans start at around 100ms for random > ones. But if the goal is 60fps, redisplay should finish at below 2ms. Which just make the point stronger - even slight performance inefficiencies for mode line constructs are affecting user experience a lot. It might be a good idea to address this problem even within the current single-threaded redisplay. What about automatically debouncing slow :eval constructs in the mode line? If we make sure that :eval constructs running longer than a threshold do not run too frequently, it can certainly improve user experience. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at