From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Marcin Borkowski Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs Lisp's future Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:16:39 +0200 Message-ID: <87d1j7we20.fsf@mbork.pl> References: <87wq97i78i.fsf@earlgrey.lan> <86k2dk77w6.fsf@molnjunk.nocrew.org> <642fd4b4-8b1c-a537-5a5f-6940691ec4b9@gmail.com> <861szo4zgq.fsf@gko.net> <86wphg2tpk.fsf@gko.net> <87eg3nwmu4.fsf@mbork.pl> <9707a440-fb03-9d0c-11f7-7bfe6cbebb6c@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1476170271 11106 195.159.176.226 (11 Oct 2016 07:17:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 07:17:51 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: mu4e 0.9.17; emacs 26.0.50.1 Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: =?utf-8?Q?Cl=C3=A9ment?= Pit--Claudel Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 11 09:17:45 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1btrJL-0006qz-Q1 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:17:15 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54112 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1btrJK-0006ai-7e for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 03:17:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:58915) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1btrIl-0006aa-NV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 03:16:40 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1btrIg-0004ao-TH for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 03:16:38 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([195.110.48.8]:38137) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1btrIg-0004Yv-LI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 03:16:34 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 143BEE684A; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:16:33 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at mail.mojserwer.eu Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.mojserwer.eu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VLxwSjG-jkx0; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:16:31 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from localhost (unknown [150.254.75.29]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EA999E64AF; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:16:30 +0200 (CEST) In-reply-to: <9707a440-fb03-9d0c-11f7-7bfe6cbebb6c@gmail.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 195.110.48.8 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:208153 Archived-At: On 2016-10-11, at 06:18, Cl=C3=A9ment Pit--Claudel wrote: > On 2016-10-11 00:06, Marcin Borkowski wrote: >> BTW, someone (Raman?) on this thread said that namespaces save typing. >> That's not exactly right; that goal is achieved with autocompletion (a= s >> he already noticed). What namespaces really do is twofold: >>=20 >> 1. Help avoid collisions, and >>=20 >> 2. (last but not least!) save on reading. >>=20 >> Long function names are really bad. > > I think nameless makes both of these a non-issue. You get "import x as= y" using custom prefixes (such as fl: for font-lock), and for your own c= ode there's no typing (C-- inserts the package prefix) and no wasted spac= e. > > Bottom line: I don't see much use for proper namespaces :) That's only true to some extent. Both names and nameless packages (even though I really appreciate them) are really prosthetics; I'd have to check it, but how do they behave with tools like xref-find-definitions, edebug, lispy and others? I'm pretty sure that names won't cooperate with them nicely (I vaguely remember trying, though I'm not sure), I'd have to check nameless. Best, --=20 Marcin Borkowski