From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs Survey 2022 - design Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 16:11:49 +0000 Message-ID: <87bkvta4e2.fsf@posteo.net> References: <87ee0sb3by.fsf@gmail.com> <877d6kvvcq.fsf@posteo.net> <87a6bdblo1.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8023"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Timothy Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu May 19 18:48:06 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nrjJl-0001pR-KQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 19 May 2022 18:48:05 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35982 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nrjJk-0007Or-GE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 19 May 2022 12:48:04 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42772) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nriky-0004l9-GD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 19 May 2022 12:12:08 -0400 Original-Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]:40007) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nrikn-0005Eb-5l for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 19 May 2022 12:12:08 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CAF64240109 for ; Thu, 19 May 2022 18:11:54 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1652976714; bh=gamW4iY1kToAglaQoq7dijmPco/2RqlTEZtKbjB8rzQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:From; b=PtcoNdjcCigMt/7piiVxPp3eR4/3X2L6xP0FYZ6EE97oVK7m0i/2HNtxQt21H5Lp7 khDNmXKlMRPJc9BgeF9K5rC44pkDxV1HV2529dWnFvgv0yShGwAT/et22LtNZu6bNe h3gayqFkWkW4RwUrATjxyY21QDsi8E/QoLn4T+I2ZPjdDBgHRRp03bjvq1mZP9hmPJ m41ODf55yuAKRNAMcldPgR/ng7z2ER/oW46vdVPJl9hf2YcrFXrIdv5pY2G7bNvEYj 4IH8XZ/rUoZAcAoBqhq9ZVqRFPKhUJmOczgzpqyOE4YxygSRgI9uY3MzIA63tIMWTt Zk3Ksoqm24QCA== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4L3vxk1fxqz9rxL; Thu, 19 May 2022 18:11:54 +0200 (CEST) Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEYHHqUhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAp3GdmYJ6tm5McweY6dEvIYIiry+Oz9rU4MH6NHWK0Ee0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiQBBMWCAA4FiEEDM2H44ZoPt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJ CAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQtVrAHPRh1FyTkgEAjlbGPxFchvMbxzAES3r8QLuZgCxeAXunM9gh io0ePtUBALVhh9G6wIoZhl0gUCbQpoN/UJHI08Gm1qDob5zDxnIHuDgEYHHqUhIKKwYBBAGXVQEF AQEHQNcRB+MUimTMqoxxMMUERpOR+Q4b1KgncDZkhrO2ql1tAwEIB4h4BBgWCAAgFiEEDM2H44Zo Pt9Ms0eHtVrAHPRh1FwFAmBx6lICGwwACgkQtVrAHPRh1Fw1JwD/Qo7kvtib8jy7puyWrSv0MeTS g8qIxgoRWJE/KKdkCLEA/jb9b9/g8nnX+UcwHf/4VfKsjExlnND3FrBviXUW6NcB In-Reply-To: <87a6bdblo1.fsf@gmail.com> (Timothy's message of "Thu, 19 May 2022 22:54:14 +0800") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:289982 Archived-At: Timothy writes: > Hi Philip, > > Thanks for the suggestions! > > Philip Kaludercic writes: > >> Great to see another survey being organised! Looking through the >> questions I=E2=80=99d like to note the following: >> >> - Add =E2=80=9CCollege=E2=80=9D to who introduced someone to Emacs > > I=E2=80=99ve changed =E2=80=9CUniversity=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9CUniversity/= College=E2=80=9D. Let me know if you think this > should be two separate options. I don't think that it should be necessary. >> - Add NonGNU ELPA to the package repositories > > Done. > >> - The list of favourite packages should not mandatory > > Hmm, is it not reasonably to assume that everybody has at least a few pac= kages > they think look pretty good? Hmm, it doesn=E2=80=99t seem too bad if we w= ere to just > have a maximum. I think there are plenty of people who use Emacs without any major changes, just because it works for them. If they have been doing this for 20, 30 or even 40 years now they might have never bothered using packages as such, beyond maybe a script they got from a friend or wrote a few decades ago ^^ >> - The built-in themes should be added to the theme list > > If we have all the built-in themes, the list gets a bit long. The approac= h I=E2=80=99m > taking is trying to prioritise the most popular options, and leave the = =E2=80=9Cother=E2=80=9D > box for everyone else. Ok, fair enough. >> - The terminal emulator question should be rephrased =E2=80=9Chow do you= use a >> shell within emacs=E2=80=9D, though this is nit-picking > > Perhaps. I=E2=80=99m not sure on this. I think everyone should get what the question in. >> - Email clients should also have Rmail, Mew and MH > > The previous survey indicated a small fraction of responses for these, is= there > a reason why you think the =E2=80=9Cother=E2=80=9D box would not be good = enough? In that case no, it should be fine. >> - Perhaps a question on what spell checking programmes are used > > It=E2=80=99s there, I think you might have missed it :) Nevermind then. >> - I think adding vundo to the undo package list would be nice > > Added! > >> (points like these should also be presented with some explanation, becau= se I >> can imagine a lot of users don=E2=80=99t even know about these packages= to begin >> with) > > Hmm. Not a bad idea. I won=E2=80=99t do this right now, but this is worth= revisiting > later. > >> - A general comment on the =E2=80=9CMy framework/starter kit=E2=80=99s d= efault=E2=80=9D. Will >> you be able to infer what they use, from the framework or is this just >> a vauge option? > > Since we ask earlier what framework/starter kit they=E2=80=99re using (if= any), yes! In > fact, I=E2=80=99m hoping this will be more informative/accurate in the ca= se of users > that haven=E2=80=99t changed the framework/starter kit default and aren= =E2=80=99t exactly sure > what they=E2=80=99re using. Great! >> - Perhaps mention fido-mode in the =E2=80=9Cselection=E2=80=9D package > > Is it used enough to be lifted out of the =E2=80=9Cother=E2=80=9D box? I = don=E2=80=99t recall seeing it > much in the 2020 survey results. I believe Fido came out in 27.1, so there probably was not much time for people to start using it back then. >> - Are the =E2=80=9Cgender=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cnationality=E2=80=9D que= stions necessary? I can imagine >> that the former one can cause a lot of complaints (especially when >> there is no =E2=80=9CI=E2=80=99d prefer not to say=E2=80=9D) option. > > There=E2=80=99s no =E2=80=9CI=E2=80=99d prefer not to say=E2=80=9D option= as the entire question is optional. If > it seems like adding that is a good idea though, I=E2=80=99m happy to do = so. > > The 2020 survey asked what people thought of adding demographic > questions, and the response was (IIRC) overwhelmingly =E2=80=9Csure, why > not=E2=80=9D. So these questions are a response to that. I missed the "Optional" annotation, in that case forget this comment too. >> - Are the =E2=80=9Cother=E2=80=9D option plain text fields or a kind of = =E2=80=9Cnone of the above=E2=80=9D? > > Text fields :) > > All the best, > Timothy