From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Harald_J=C3=B6rg?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Please do not deprecate perl-mode in favour of cperl-mode Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2023 10:10:12 +0000 Message-ID: <87a5qrzjej.fsf@oook.m.uunet.de> References: <5d846dd1b7a8b557073b317863bc590a@purelymail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1980"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: "Paul W. Rankin" To: "Paul W. Rankin" via "Emacs development discussions." Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Dec 03 11:11:17 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1r9jRT-0000Du-T6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 Dec 2023 11:11:15 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r9jQj-0004jV-GA; Sun, 03 Dec 2023 05:10:29 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r9jQf-0004jE-Qx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Dec 2023 05:10:26 -0500 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r9jQa-0007ch-2m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Dec 2023 05:10:25 -0500 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A8434240027 for ; Sun, 3 Dec 2023 11:10:13 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.de; s=2017; t=1701598213; bh=zjryO8eq+NFgX9EnngMLa1KJXkfkLAIgaf7kAED6bEc=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:From; b=ZtibdZae2q6FArQr2r+G+YKbzX+M4Gold8SQrrnvJHJlSyNeUSwA73cIymIhzCynR Y8VIuRMZB02mvp7D2imgPV9H5DRh5i0Du5xWGFUYBytC3uM0MZUrYSYWBGOWoeRPHm Pjk40MNmu8lPdXWRlI++oNILAVHfnpFDEq7mvqf3LRV5x2JTJEopHXcQ43uEuyr7e8 HHbtJcV00amLSZ82pV9Fr/tA+sBKqZb+02ni2HdK7BOha7xqhkPw3T3LipHsJwaEHU Kw5iFFj93n/KSBCV6c9CZub90Nuk/H94FkncxJ1M6g6VXN7RhzcAAo7ZZcTdlPqrf8 hNlS1YEMXTj9Q== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4SjjGY0jtkz6tvJ; Sun, 3 Dec 2023 11:10:13 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <5d846dd1b7a8b557073b317863bc590a@purelymail.com> (Paul W. Rankin's message of "Sun, 03 Dec 2023 16:36:10 +1000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=haj@posteo.de; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:313489 Archived-At: Paul W. Rankin writes: > I am writing in response to a mention I saw today on Mastodon, which > appears supported by the EtherPad, that there is plan to deprecate > Perl Mode in favour of C Perl Mode in Emacs. > > If this is true can I please urge a reconsideration? A better description would be: deprecate perl-mode.el in favour of cperl-mode.el. It is not intended to make M-x perl-mode go away, but to implement its look and feel with cperl-mode.el. The main motivation for this that maintaining two modes to keep up with changes in Perl syntax is not very efficient. > C Perl Mode has several quirks that make it behave unlike a normal > Emacs Major mode, including: > > - unorthodox code indentation > - behaviour of TAB on region does not perform indent-region > - use of specific faces instead of font-lock-* faces This is exactly why comments like yours are welcome: I want to know which of the differences are annoying for users of Perl mode. In particular: - Code indentation: Both Perl mode and CPerl mode offer several user options to affect indentation (too many of them in CPerl mode IMHO). I am confident that it is possible to mimick Perl mode's default indentation by options. Concrete examples are very welcome (like those you provided with your next reply). They will make it into the test suite. - TAB for indenting region: That's also something that should be doable. CPerl mode's behaviour for indent-region is indeed very idiosyncratic (and underdocumented). - use of specific faces: This will be fixed in CPerl mode anyway, independent of the deprecation. This doesn't mean that the rich coloration which some people like will go away, but that all faces will default to font-lock-* faces if cperl-mode.el starts in Perl mode style. > (Perl Mode, meanwhile, works just fine.) Perl Mode works fine for many applications - but it also has a list of deficiencies (and a list of open bugs, some of them pretty old). > I don't wish to dampen the enthusiasm of the originator of this > Perl->C Perl idea, but I would implore you to please first address C > Perl Mode's shortcoming as a 1:1 replacement for Perl Mode before the > baby/bathwater? C Perl Mode should at least work as well as Perl Mode > before deprecation is considered. That's exactly what I'm trying to do these days. It will take some time, since it isn't the only project Im working on :/ -- Cheers, haj