From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juri Linkov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: 23.0.50; Middle w in of permissions in dired-mode is red and bold: dired-warning Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 02:16:54 +0200 Organization: JURTA Message-ID: <878x0kuagl.fsf@jurta.org> References: <87hckt9z1u.fsf_-_@jurta.org> <878x0n1g86.fsf@jurta.org> <877ig50vta.fsf@stupidchicken.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1205540610 11442 80.91.229.12 (15 Mar 2008 00:23:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 00:23:30 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Chong Yidong Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Mar 15 01:23:58 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JaKBp-0005fE-GW for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 15 Mar 2008 01:23:57 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JaKBG-0006QT-7a for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:23:22 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JaKBA-0006OK-P2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:23:16 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JaKB8-0006Ls-Kg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:23:16 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JaKB8-0006Li-GW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:23:14 -0400 Original-Received: from relay01.kiev.sovam.com ([62.64.120.200]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JaKB4-0005k7-SJ; Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:23:11 -0400 Original-Received: from [83.170.232.243] (helo=smtp.svitonline.com) by relay01.kiev.sovam.com with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1JaKB2-000Q0r-6S; Sat, 15 Mar 2008 02:23:08 +0200 In-Reply-To: <877ig50vta.fsf@stupidchicken.com> (Chong Yidong's message of "Fri, 14 Mar 2008 18:45:05 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) X-Scanner-Signature: a8c813420754d5015e2a5a3aeed75c84 X-DrWeb-checked: yes X-SpamTest-Envelope-From: juri@jurta.org X-SpamTest-Group-ID: 00000000 X-SpamTest-Header: Not Detected X-SpamTest-Info: Profiles 2421 [Mar 14 2008] X-SpamTest-Info: helo_type=3 X-SpamTest-Info: {HEADERS: header Content-Type found without required header Content-Transfer-Encoding} X-SpamTest-Method: none X-SpamTest-Rate: 11 X-SpamTest-Status: Not detected X-SpamTest-Status-Extended: not_detected X-SpamTest-Version: SMTP-Filter Version 3.0.0 [0255], KAS30/Release X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: FreeBSD 4.8-5.1 (or MacOS X 10.2-10.3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:92634 Archived-At: >> When testing Emacs 22 with `emacs -Q', I see that dired buffers are >> almost unusable by default. The red bold face for write permissions >> is very distracting that prevents focusing on other parts of the dired >> buffer. I'm afraid Emacs users will hate us for this if we release >> Emacs 22.2 with this annoyance. > > I haven't been paying attention here, so sorry if this has been > discussed elsewhere in the thread. > > As far as I can tell, the face is meant to be distracting. It's > supposed to warn when files are writable by other users. Why would > this feature make Emacs users hate us? I think no face should be distracting. In very rare cases, a strong color should indicate an error, so the user has to fix it immediately, thus removing this error together with the face indication from the view. In case of group/world write permissions, usually there is no error, so no action is required from the user to remove write permissions immediately after seeing them, because in most cases these permissions are valid. Often the user even can't change permission, for instance, when a non-root user browses the /usr hierarchy that has group/world write permissions on many files. So file permissions should not be the first place to attract attention of the user to after visiting a dired buffer. > If you really really dislike (hate?) the warning face, one thing we > could try is to make it red and non-bold on terminals that support > colors. If that's an acceptable compromise, then we can safely go > ahead and make that change. Actually a good face to use is font-lock-comment-delimiter-face because it is not glaring as font-lock-warning-face. -- Juri Linkov http://www.jurta.org/emacs/