From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Michael Albinus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Tramp as ELPA package Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 20:04:51 +0200 Message-ID: <878t4t9f7g.fsf@gmx.de> References: <20180819204918.GA3934@ACM> <20180821162043.GA3946@ACM> <20180823213418.GA32596@ACM> <83lg8w9mt2.fsf@gnu.org> <871saoc70o.fsf@gmx.de> <87wosebzur.fsf_-_@gmx.de> <87tvnh9yg6.fsf@gmx.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1535307435 18256 195.159.176.226 (26 Aug 2018 18:17:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 18:17:15 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Aug 26 20:17:11 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ftzb4-0004ev-7N for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 20:17:10 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:49972 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ftzdA-0002Il-Hr for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 14:19:20 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:59915) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ftzbq-0001rM-9g for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 14:18:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ftzPQ-0005w8-Ry for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 14:05:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.21]:58783) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ftzPL-0005sz-BC; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 14:05:03 -0400 Original-Received: from detlef.gmx.de ([212.86.41.140]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx102 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Lqn7e-1fOWCz0gvS-00eP6f; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 20:04:55 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Sun, 26 Aug 2018 11:21:09 -0400") X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:7pGuqi3Iq3zAc4jWDyYCVeweAIxLIizuvrwxt+LXouW+M8hPIzH pdWamimbTK/UqoBinvwMwNsqMaQke66E5JLC9+pew7G6swAf3pHTiXLtcc2XofqFSfYteMg 0qz6RoXxYNvuWleQI1ZyChIVNzJ833g2xg5fuMfpHS7ysD5ro1Ta0s+YJokxrTAoJ1r7yVw L+cM0okENviIa3uJSwO5Q== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:Rm1IGdA4qIg=:jdi/6ajFvbgiUlW7idCy9+ 1KEiZbHuPktqwreiIfDxhAy/IQitjPSOWdgsrWytEDrshTT1R3HmIK2qnxrE/6byYX/CGJ75I DpbZnn1fc0ttRGTZJxlyhqC//BahWmaqnUZ03a0w2CWLvZWzgUVhhn/r7WfPrCGpg5W90t0GD rV8m0GiGzDp2NNFSrm6zBt50Kc5Y17rzOz5W2GwlelOhWgi/2zUlNfgjVd0TPZhA0P9KAsjb5 K8Q6oZc1fg1OJkDQuhnTcUF1mCT2mi9BtJZvYRWDG7W4Y08gXbqb6pIaxUI/P+Zi9slnwaPsr AQ5HGwIZ2HUVPvFW9ZY8M/DRXHtK+mAp+LWjxSzZZgQlRzbYpjnsUY/dwuoQFmflRJ+jtKq1E mNQFZhW3KG3tBYxwlKCU7rtudmUPQtVfAPb41M/L3fgssEn2Xli+XYG0yOE6+uL+NNuygwwz+ Mq525JDf8cR+xX0QTrkwu3eeXAQHALPrMY4irWA7bWBcaRcs2EPuGKCB5jzzhKbydGb8rcGGx 34jMWlG7QaXUofvbeIonOUzXjYZkxQSWHVXl1sUUjqlFNDzOMVYKRNcaqXxJtQCqNZd3K+gnX qgjazmfG6EXyLoNb7nhQHi7f0E2h5IZeXmp5zhRLTc3C436SDvAdkKWWd7iK8VwlN5RB3iTUW dj1Gn8Q3GDA/J6El2KI5QlVjitqZiiEG3o1L3y5/tN0c7iGzvWle2DghSvtjXg9Igmprf5MBI uWZFt7UwTah5xlPkYEDhmC7/zUje/HyTIV3+NxdoJJ1dVl+2qdo9kTp36WgrqPF/UfhJ6JsS X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 212.227.17.21 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:228944 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: > To the extent that the *-pre aren't distributed IIUC, I'm not sure what > problem would be caused by simply keeping the version string at "2.4.0" > instead of "2.4.1-pre". Between "2.4.0" and "2.4.1", there is half-a-year. Very likely, I would like to release error fixes in the time between. And for debugging purposes, it is important whether somebody uses a Tramp release like "2.4.0", or something taken from a repository, named "2.4.1-pre". In the latter case, I must be more careful to understand, which Tramp file versions are used. >> Maybe we need an intermediate release string as the MELPA packages >> have: add a time stamp in the Version: header of tramp.el *only* in >> the Emacs repository, whenever a new version of Tramp shall appear as >> package, like 2.4.1.pre.20180826. This shouldn't be done >> automatically, by intention only. An automatic release of Tramp as >> ELPA package might be too frequent, I fear. > > I don't understand: GNU ELPA packages are only created when the > Version: changes, so it's only as frequent as you choose it to be. That's the problem. If I keep the release scheme "2.4.0", 2.4.1", ..., there's a release every half-a-year. I don't want to change this timing, because it is always a several-days effort for a release. I do run heavy regression tests prior the release, for example. But maybe we shall indeed use something like a Tramp ELPA package release scheme, with something like "2.4.0.1", "2.4.0.2", ..., without all the effort to make a "real" release as tarball, as it should still happen. >> * Several Tramp versions. I maintain several Tramp versions in parallel, >> currently 2.3.4 and 2.4.1. I'm not confident that 2.4.1 shall be the >> ELPA package today, because new features will be added here, and it is >> kind of unstable, therefore. I believe, 2.3.4 would be better suited >> for all users *not* running Emacs 27.0.50. Users running Emacs 27.0.50 >> do not need Tramp as ELPA package, because it is always synced with >> the Emacs repository. How do we manage this? > > We don't. Org-mode is in the same situation. > > All other packages (including Emacs itself, BTW) far only have one > "active" release, basically. No. Emacs has the master branch, and the emacs-26 branch. I would call both "active". > IIUC the multiple-releases dance is mostly out-of-fashion in these days > of "DevOps". I don't understand what you mean with this. (And yes, I know what DevOps means in general.) >> * Providing Tramp documentation. IIUC, ELPA packages could contain >> *.texi and *.info files, but they are not propagated to the >> users. This shall be enhanced, because new features of Tramp are >> reflected there. > > The .info files are "propagated to the users", but the .texi files > indeed are currently left unused. As Tom reminded me, it requires to add a proper "dir" file to the Tramp ELPA package. Since it would be a core package, I ave no idea where this file to take from. > Stefan Best regrads, Michael.