From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Po Lu Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: recent change to yanking behavior of the clipboard Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2022 21:15:07 +0800 Message-ID: <878rumhl7o.fsf@yahoo.com> References: <87zgn4nsui.fsf@yahoo.com> <875yprmq3t.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="3805"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.60 (gnu/linux) Cc: xenodasein--- via "Emacs development discussions." , xenodasein@tutanota.de To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Feb 07 14:33:02 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nH48c-0000kx-B3 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2022 14:33:02 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50234 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nH48a-0005Qi-3Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2022 08:33:00 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40486) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nH3re-0001RX-QJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2022 08:15:30 -0500 Original-Received: from sonic301-31.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.184.200]:42852) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nH3ra-0001AW-W9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2022 08:15:30 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1644239723; bh=iyGG1C4DgWtG0qVAn2lYJIMopiIPuX/KU4Rhx8vwGXo=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=a1aOKLVth5UN1ek7UAMfpYycHPczXeKZqdm7WvgqVQ3IeE+ju64X3WMaxwGkxAl1l+EN56F1IloVrCHIvwKLo8BqdxkLZ10sMD3rUW6it1C5DpqoI6vbo2cHbmaY0UhPZWseqYt9aeBhB+fA4CdgkOQhCAqllPKsa3CYYs6reCf5XgMis/dgtbutSPTM/zHzHDqby5BoUg71q+lr7gFyeMx0ZmZEqxFv46XOWBcRL3hhTV8nLgKR3HwpIUGYmjyDrg4V9/s90LFek33G4fF7uiOODSgBrwcwp6VFVTUVNoICZQP+/pj1d+7jwPgmkcV4XFuCil87/rNh+SKTiBAoLw== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1644239723; bh=Y1YYlKc2rIs3XWSq6iP5CabZRdKA4oduUZpIHlcD80F=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=sGxKTO6hmBaH0V0QvqyNq3J2FEhpZI7qfb2M+rg2TQ5tB9mhzlzSyZIuhE+ta76EJg121cCCd/pQsJXBuzyAsi0wmSxOfogdJxpaSDCRtyWlUEJhOib0zD+U/KRd5db4R2FnJT1M0WWwfhWudUSQJF6HC7rRvsHVk0fRgZrEnNLaL8WMX19nkgqRXzqbAb5J5n1jwGa2NpMsbnne1B/xVehI9xnouU+Y/ii4SCcNo2zTMD2uKErsuo2KnMiJpp8vxfjudeWQFOuH3e1YJvZTo/z6VAUUAdcjxncYFruqT9xyPnSjzJOxmJn8jlS3SoIIhEMjgZ2wjmLVnHMRIm99QQ== X-YMail-OSG: 3iHBzcMVM1kDUoTS.dpxZpZGxT3iTWQsFv8eDZd2XnH3ZLRhkDkFB9ythakagTx VbDu8WWn8EV7.6pnb97rTdoq_VmvGlzzmoz7l0PlBIo0wuUiLJr.LCnr6cxl5z3SdQ0ewOaFBYXm 4ONWzdJGNtJ2r3kBs952quF4JwXk6d0J8WHJrk7nUmi9Iql63J2mwkFtbP87M0_AJnbNCucFHSM2 6nbJ65iM.a3YvpXoHNvPI8pRjXAhIiXzyBJnrUCOa0hZfKz4uaOpfSuL0p1vAHxakuk9csIz3x9Y Cg13X17ODCsLNLQKmRpnEM9bkcYWbjMU2K2z70vEIzOY3P0i25Nt9RinwUxYJJ7YGqARRhCsHaPn uEnyLzZjEY.TwTaMKRNhTWC7cDVI4GQ5_UgisQ1y501uWroFlJbk_lr7d7mrFHx2lVHtq6rl4pv3 d1MJy31i7waiBCGKeIDJ6PSfy_UBaReX2ep7YzFKHjFJwIegp.CVQ7NR_kc8SrsFYBrpgmNoI16W NcDuXQaIaBG4xUbq.Q91rjoVDeRX.hMVy_Sjm_fAJWVLeCE0F_8IAbepwltrMCba7BxvHTE5VIPy ZwwCuw8odmCoLHmq2oJAUWZJ3MzK2TbOdY6DUKszMco1uFOF_pbId9.DcST0CZWTrsZJ3fUaxuGe BrSbklIjBGvU_zAQG0VoNZ2_xKKiHu4TT8XxTcDpVHCa6WhPxaajxDCLBYd9KSvm8jizByQ9LVXg Uwv7ce_N1cb4GKA5XPfqcV9iDLT6ieHtEkCcit9YP8qoJAUB8x8BglfA5GAfRHZA8xVd8tS6OMYN gtv5YXaffAzz7fNq4_90MWOgzA2.5DUKfSMI_pWBtL X-Sonic-MF: Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic301.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2022 13:15:23 +0000 Original-Received: by kubenode516.mail-prod1.omega.sg3.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID f19e821d3275e5158fc03b85a7366334; Mon, 07 Feb 2022 13:15:16 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Mon, 07 Feb 2022 08:04:19 -0500") X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.19711 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Received-SPF: pass client-ip=66.163.184.200; envelope-from=luangruo@yahoo.com; helo=sonic301-31.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:286035 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >> I see no point in sticking to behaviour obsoleted by the operating >> system, such as storing cut text in the primary selection. On X, every >> client has to cooperate with every other client in order to have working >> cut and paste, and a single client deviating from that is sufficient to >> bring down the entire deck-of-cards. > Now I'm lost. What you say here seems to claim that the change under > discussion brings Emacs in line with the official/standard protocol. > Yet that change is very specific to the `CLIPBOARD` whereas I'd expect > such an official protocol to behave the same for all types of selections. No, this is something else unrelated to the original change: I'm trying to coinvince people not to use `select-enable-primary', at least lightly, and those prior changes you referred to changed the default value of `select-enable-primary'. Further down another thread someone said that was common advice on the internet, which is shocking, since that amounts to teaching people to break their systems. > Elsewhere you said that the motivation was one of optimization > of performance. Yet Noah's original message points out a change in > actual behavior rather than mere performance. > > I'm having difficulty reconciling those somewhat contradictory facts. > > Could someone walk me through step-by-step what happens in one or two cases, > (e.g. Noah's case, or the "normal" case) explaining what Emacs does and > why, how the patch affects the outcome and what the ideal behavior would > be according to the standard protocol? We don't know what happens in Noah case yet. He hasn't replied to my questions. Thanks.