From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Karl Fogel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Unable to close a bug in the tracker. Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:06 -0500 Message-ID: <877hrlo5cx.fsf@red-bean.com> References: <87iqb5o7ie.fsf@red-bean.com> <878wc1h524.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Reply-To: Karl Fogel NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1263431675 5995 80.91.229.12 (14 Jan 2010 01:14:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 01:14:35 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Chong Yidong Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jan 14 02:14:28 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NVEI4-00089j-HB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2010 02:14:24 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49034 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NVEI4-00007N-VV for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:24 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NVEHy-00006y-UP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:18 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NVEHt-00006l-EH for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:17 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=43498 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NVEHt-00006i-8u for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:13 -0500 Original-Received: from sanpietro.red-bean.com ([66.146.206.141]:37004) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NVEHs-0006Tb-VG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:14:13 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41058 helo=kfogel-work ident=kfogel) by sanpietro.red-bean.com with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NVEHs-0002iJ-3S; Wed, 13 Jan 2010 19:14:12 -0600 In-Reply-To: <878wc1h524.fsf@stupidchicken.com> (Chong Yidong's message of "Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:02:27 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.1.91 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:119949 Archived-At: Chong Yidong writes: >You're in the "automatically accept" list, so your messages should go >through to the bug tracker without moderation. But I don't see it in >the debbugs-submit archive. Strange; I'll investigate. Thanks. >Some of your criticisms boil down to "the bug page displays too much >information which is distracting to users". Fair enough, I'll take a >look at whether we can hide some of this information. (Though, to my >eyes, the average Emacs bug page is a lot less intimidating looking >than, say, than average Launchpad bug page, which has about ten times >the number of "angry fruit salad" links, so tastes clearly differ.) I don't think that's the important part. The distractions on the page are just distractions -- annoying, but they can be ignored. The more important part of my criticism is in the "general problems with the system as a whole" section, especially the uncertain response time and unreliability, and the lack of clear UI for manipulating bug states. Those are killer. Tastes do differ, but if you did a user survey, or user testing, which do you think would come out ahead? :-) I mentioned Launchpad only because it's one of the few that offer both web and email UI (and does both well, IMHO), and therefore is a proof-by-existence that it doesn't have to be this way. We could use Bugzilla and still come out ahead. Is there any convenient way to get access to the full bug database? Like, all the mbox files, or something like that? I'd be interested in getting that, if so, to do a little statistical trawling. -Karl