From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Michael Albinus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Change Tramp syntax Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 20:44:15 +0100 Message-ID: <8760jfegz4.fsf@detlef> References: <20170309184457.29604.13048@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <20170309184458.08C9725FCF@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <87k27xfo3q.fsf@detlef> <87efy5fmml.fsf@detlef> <87mvcti5he.fsf_-_@detlef> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1489261480 17032 195.159.176.226 (11 Mar 2017 19:44:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 19:44:40 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Mar 11 20:44:35 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1cmmwL-0003ls-Sd for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 20:44:34 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44529 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cmmwR-0006PL-Aj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 14:44:39 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:52896) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cmmwJ-0006PG-1D for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 14:44:32 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cmmwF-0004FI-TZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 14:44:31 -0500 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:59757) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1cmmwF-0004Cr-Ex for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 14:44:27 -0500 Original-Received: from detlef.gmx.de ([87.146.50.95]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx002 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MK17F-1clxzQ3UJB-001Pqt; Sat, 11 Mar 2017 20:44:18 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Fri, 10 Mar 2017 11:56:05 -0500") X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:icJQwHGL6+rXqoiHjIhqHU6WY94IVkKbyluriNnlvUME7dofHVm tD6w20j5HXcezPgoA6BI+zv9tdr721S0Ybe8M4RIUX3OUYujpljSPP6tfYMVRFL9NeCH5i9 Q8xNAJY7LbEb5IWVWjnNBgsGy8Kk4D4s0suTaiS/DCDZpXseebPGuhn9lCPLEQjSuEItWYF dXCo54jwhkzyo/nezlIPA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:Q+sUSfJrjZc=:kuW8NegSiBWb7DzVGGQd5x +tFWj1jLnn7kEI8KumKPCOS+9eIH1KaxHj154nd6y7SOGDOaRVJwFLuB9co1yc34/DteCt5Pn PDqCycooPVVJDAo6QP7jMIJ516axn9L1MUulQ5w/omzjborQWh4sSFSBOexCLrwpu/0EvsEht G0+9E5J8p4ZtX+YorBGNxt0LiXUcWzpr/uUZlguE3LWuJvQw8+6edeq0hW7eH6DKzIRKFyfx/ QiudUbQk4GgM4wnDszRpbOmhqPlIi8h8hUgoiWzADSiqa0UJRLqudhIN1eDetJXYkY2HI2KjT 77BHdbr8rX5i1WeAKJFSMauAoTJsUu0VPtDhaTf4n/UlZmnrvr5fBOPyDUK88bo501j9pCWoH ZqpRIZIQX7Q31gDOhFXep1mxxJetDv2MpO0zvbg8krz98h30GKllKWczwadrkRqEPoxN8k9Rk RjJVA0x6SNEy9jeUtGnW7sWOiLUcLTOsyNjbF8g5YdgLqRiOYD2pt6YAgngBHTFfpDHYT7mqY 1mvnGGZPtdgHCoiOQIMsjQTKbpxRjKz6adxBn+f6LYnVzlVHUQD9UiudT1cnu9iViVyIhZXjv tmlop1kBsCMl5ZmGvZrSb0kv6MdER7TXjkjPJnEbEr3RXWo7z/7g7nN0sYk3BuBJ6BEmR8JRG eEY9arsFR8pODLhlrldThRVhgqZYuLx+NTNK2H0bg57dcrZyOxfCeDq4ZgB++CMK/OT22YQKF EJZ4U4Zw54fOHpuBPMSU8WPiyz9GRdQxo1Ap8//NPGm/yJ8ZD6prrd3K2LjZPLqrRbSkUC/K X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 212.227.15.18 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:212919 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: Hi Stefan, >> Maybe we shall start a poll, in emacs-devel, emacs-help and >> tramp-devel. We should not ask what a user prefers (many of them will >> prefer not to type a method). They question must be what will be broken >> if we stop support for ange-ftp syntax "/host:/path/to/file". > > Actually, there are several options, for example: > 1- Get rid of ange-ftp syntax altogether, like you propose. > 2- Keep the syntax, but only when it doesn't collide with the > Tramp syntax. I.e. /fencepost:foo will still be allowed, but > if you want to access a host named "ssh" you'll need something like > /ftp:ssh:foo or /ssh:ssh:foo or /ssh.domain:foo or /user@ssh:foo. > I.e. /foo: will only be considered ange-ftp syntax if `foo` is not a method. > 3- Like 2 but treat /foo:./bar and /foo:/bar as an ange-ftp syntax even if > `foo` is a method. Currently, we have implemented option 2. But the check, whether the host name in /ssh:foo collides with a method, happens too late, because file name handlers are fired by parsing the file name, and not by additional checks (like a function call). If we want to go this way, it must be option 1. Or must we allow file name handlers to be activated by a function call, instead of merely checking a regexp. > I never use ange-ftp syntax (although I only ever use the `ssh` method), > so I could live with 1 (and it sure would simplify the code), but I'm in > favor of option 2 because I think it is the simplest option that still > preserves the main benefit of the ange-ftp syntax (i.e. the default > method). > >> This would also mean, that we cannot support default methods anymore. A >> file name with a default method would look like "/:host:/path/to/file", >> which is already the quoted file name syntax. > > If really needed we could use something like `/-:host:`. Agreed. This preserves the default method, by the cost of additional typing "- :". Let's see how much head wind there will be due to cutting default method, and in case of we might offer this as compromise. > Stefan Best regards, Michael.