[ELPA] Add Agitate package

[ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

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Hello everyone,

I want to install the attached patch on elpa.git.

Agitate is a collection of commands or potentially useful functions
that expand on the available version control features of Emacs.  Those
are meant to complement a workflow that relies on the built-in Version
Control framework and its accoutrements ('diff-mode.el',
'log-view.el', 'log-edit.el', 'vc-git.el', and potentially others).

The reason I am posting this here is because I want to ask if it is okay
to publish such a package, given that at least some of its code may be
better suited for emacs.git directly.  I prefer the package format for
the time being, because it gives me (and others) the chance to refine
the code and decide on what is worth contributing to core Emacs.

If you are fine with this, I will just install the patch on elpa.git.

Thank you!

All the best,
Protesilaos (or simply "Prot")

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

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From a9b91f6bb7cc931dd54e62750d1e94942eb8b8eb Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
Message-Id: <a9b91f6bb7cc931dd54e62750d1e94942eb8b8eb.1664258101.git.info@protesilaos.com>
From: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 08:54:55 +0300
Subject: [PATCH] * elpa-packages (agitate): New package

---
 elpa-packages | 5 +++++
 1 file changed, 5 insertions(+)

diff --git a/elpa-packages b/elpa-packages
index 146d85fa4b..5130cd8e9a 100644
--- a/elpa-packages
+++ b/elpa-packages
@@ -49,6 +49,11 @@
   :auto-sync t)
  ("aggressive-indent"	:url "https://github.com/Malabarba/aggressive-indent-mode"
   :auto-sync t)
+ ("agitate"
+  :url "https://git.sr.ht/~protesilaos/agitate"
+  :auto-sync t
+  :doc "README.org"
+  :ignored-files ("COPYING" "doclicense.texi"))
  ("ahungry-theme"	:url "https://github.com/ahungry/color-theme-ahungry")
  ("aircon-theme"        :url "https://git.sr.ht/~chambln/aircon-theme.el"
   :ignored-files ("README" "COPYING")
-- 
2.37.3

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Philip Kaludercic]

Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com> writes:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I want to install the attached patch on elpa.git.
>
> Agitate is a collection of commands or potentially useful functions
> that expand on the available version control features of Emacs.  Those
> are meant to complement a workflow that relies on the built-in Version
> Control framework and its accoutrements ('diff-mode.el',
> 'log-view.el', 'log-edit.el', 'vc-git.el', and potentially others).
>
> The reason I am posting this here is because I want to ask if it is okay
> to publish such a package, given that at least some of its code may be
> better suited for emacs.git directly.  I prefer the package format for
> the time being, because it gives me (and others) the chance to refine
> the code and decide on what is worth contributing to core Emacs.

Do you plan to upstream the package features eventually, when the
package has matured?

> If you are fine with this, I will just install the patch on elpa.git.
>
> Thank you!
>
> All the best,
> Protesilaos (or simply "Prot")
>
> -- 
> Protesilaos Stavrou
> https://protesilaos.com
>
> From a9b91f6bb7cc931dd54e62750d1e94942eb8b8eb Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
> Message-Id: <a9b91f6bb7cc931dd54e62750d1e94942eb8b8eb.1664258101.git.info@protesilaos.com>
> From: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 08:54:55 +0300
> Subject: [PATCH] * elpa-packages (agitate): New package
>
> ---
>  elpa-packages | 5 +++++
>  1 file changed, 5 insertions(+)
>
> diff --git a/elpa-packages b/elpa-packages
> index 146d85fa4b..5130cd8e9a 100644
> --- a/elpa-packages
> +++ b/elpa-packages
> @@ -49,6 +49,11 @@
>    :auto-sync t)
>   ("aggressive-indent"	:url "https://github.com/Malabarba/aggressive-indent-mode"
>    :auto-sync t)
> + ("agitate"
> +  :url "https://git.sr.ht/~protesilaos/agitate"
> +  :auto-sync t
> +  :doc "README.org"
> +  :ignored-files ("COPYING" "doclicense.texi"))
>   ("ahungry-theme"	:url "https://github.com/ahungry/color-theme-ahungry")
>   ("aircon-theme"        :url "https://git.sr.ht/~chambln/aircon-theme.el"
>    :ignored-files ("README" "COPYING")

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk@posteo.net>
> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 08:01:22 +0000

> [... 13 lines elided]

>> The reason I am posting this here is because I want to ask if it is okay
>> to publish such a package, given that at least some of its code may be
>> better suited for emacs.git directly.  I prefer the package format for
>> the time being, because it gives me (and others) the chance to refine
>> the code and decide on what is worth contributing to core Emacs.
>
> Do you plan to upstream the package features eventually, when the
> package has matured?

Yes, that is the idea.

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Sean Whitton]

Hello Prot,

On Tue 27 Sep 2022 at 09:01AM +03, Protesilaos Stavrou wrote:

> I want to install the attached patch on elpa.git.
>
> Agitate is a collection of commands or potentially useful functions
> that expand on the available version control features of Emacs.  Those
> are meant to complement a workflow that relies on the built-in Version
> Control framework and its accoutrements ('diff-mode.el',
> 'log-view.el', 'log-edit.el', 'vc-git.el', and potentially others).
>
> The reason I am posting this here is because I want to ask if it is okay
> to publish such a package, given that at least some of its code may be
> better suited for emacs.git directly.  I prefer the package format for
> the time being, because it gives me (and others) the chance to refine
> the code and decide on what is worth contributing to core Emacs.

I just looked through the file.  I recently read your prot-vc.el from
your personal Emacs configuration, and I believe that most (or all?) of
Agitate is a cleaned-up version of that?

I think that it is always worth taking a fresh look at one's personal
code and seeing if versions of parts of it might be upstreamable, so
thank you for your work.  One does have to accept, as I'm sure you
realise, that some things will be too idiosyncratic or personal to be
much use to others.  So it's reasonable to assume, given its origin,
that Agitate is a mixture of things that should eventually go into
emacs.git and things which should not.

In that case, it doesn't make too much sense to me to add it to ELPA,
but not for the reasons that you give.  It's not that code which is
targeting emacs.git cannot go on ELPA first, but it seems to me that
anything on ELPA should be a coherent, singular package.  And Agitate
isn't that -- it's a collection of functionality that you're filtering
things out of over time.

For myself, I'm looking forward to seeing some of this in core.

-- 
Sean Whitton

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>
> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 09:08:39 -0700
>
> Hello Prot,

Hello Sean,

> On Tue 27 Sep 2022 at 09:01AM +03, Protesilaos Stavrou wrote:
>
>> I want to install the attached patch on elpa.git.
>>
>> Agitate is a collection of commands or potentially useful functions
>> that expand on the available version control features of Emacs.  Those
>> are meant to complement a workflow that relies on the built-in Version
>> Control framework and its accoutrements ('diff-mode.el',
>> 'log-view.el', 'log-edit.el', 'vc-git.el', and potentially others).
>>
>> The reason I am posting this here is because I want to ask if it is okay
>> to publish such a package, given that at least some of its code may be
>> better suited for emacs.git directly.  I prefer the package format for
>> the time being, because it gives me (and others) the chance to refine
>> the code and decide on what is worth contributing to core Emacs.
>
> I just looked through the file.  I recently read your prot-vc.el from
> your personal Emacs configuration, and I believe that most (or all?) of
> Agitate is a cleaned-up version of that?

Thanks for taking the time to do that and to write this!  You are right:
some it is a rewritten version of what I had been using in my own setup.
Though I discarded most parts.  The idea with the package is to continue
with the discarding+refining process, with whatever help from the
community.

> I think that it is always worth taking a fresh look at one's personal
> code and seeing if versions of parts of it might be upstreamable, so
> thank you for your work.  One does have to accept, as I'm sure you
> realise, that some things will be too idiosyncratic or personal to be
> much use to others.  So it's reasonable to assume, given its origin,
> that Agitate is a mixture of things that should eventually go into
> emacs.git and things which should not.

I agree.

> In that case, it doesn't make too much sense to me to add it to ELPA,
> but not for the reasons that you give.  It's not that code which is
> targeting emacs.git cannot go on ELPA first, but it seems to me that
> anything on ELPA should be a coherent, singular package.  And Agitate
> isn't that -- it's a collection of functionality that you're filtering
> things out of over time.

The part about coherence is the trickiest when it comes to VC because
the whole workflow involves different processes, some of which are
implemented in vc-*.el, others in log-edit.el, and the like.  I think
that what I have and am working towards (this is not the finished
article) is coherent in terms of workflow.  Though I wanted to have this
discussion exactly because I may be caught in a bubble and misjudging
things.

> For myself, I'm looking forward to seeing some of this in core.

Yes, that is the end goal: to determine what should be in emacs.git and
which form it should take.

Thanks again!

All the best,
Prot

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Sean Whitton]

Hello,

On Tue 27 Sep 2022 at 08:18PM +03, Protesilaos Stavrou wrote:

> The part about coherence is the trickiest when it comes to VC because
> the whole workflow involves different processes, some of which are
> implemented in vc-*.el, others in log-edit.el, and the like.

Good point.

> I think that what I have and am working towards (this is not the
> finished article) is coherent in terms of workflow.  Though I wanted
> to have this discussion exactly because I may be caught in a bubble
> and misjudging things.

I don't know about being caught in a bubble, but based on reading the
file I cannot observe the coherency.  Perhaps you could try articulating
it in prose, if you want me to try again.  However, I would suggest just
working on patches to emacs.git instead, and having the rest of us think
about those singularly.

-- 
Sean Whitton

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>
> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 15:07:07 -0700

> [... 11 lines elided]

>> I think that what I have and am working towards (this is not the
>> finished article) is coherent in terms of workflow.  Though I wanted
>> to have this discussion exactly because I may be caught in a bubble
>> and misjudging things.
>
> I don't know about being caught in a bubble, but based on reading the
> file I cannot observe the coherency.  Perhaps you could try articulating
> it in prose, if you want me to try again.  However, I would suggest just
> working on patches to emacs.git instead, and having the rest of us think
> about those singularly.

It will be articulated as well.  This is a matter of developing the
package and getting it to a stable version.  It still is in its early
days and lots of ideas are not implemented yet.

Individual patches will not happen at this stage.  I am not ready.
Those are the end goal.  Now is the stage of exploration and
experimentation: putting code together and testing if it is worth
having.  The package gives me something to work towards.

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Stefan Kangas]

Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> writes:

> In that case, it doesn't make too much sense to me to add it to ELPA,
> but not for the reasons that you give.  It's not that code which is
> targeting emacs.git cannot go on ELPA first, but it seems to me that
> anything on ELPA should be a coherent, singular package.  And Agitate
> isn't that -- it's a collection of functionality that you're filtering
> things out of over time.

FWIW, I don't think this is a very strong reason not to add it.  Other
packages are also grab bags of features, and while perhaps not "ideal"
in an abstract sense, they also provide useful functionality.  In this
case it also makes sense to me to use a package as a way to experiment
with features before they hit core.

We can always delete the package later, once it has done its intended
job and is fully absorbed by Emacs.

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2022 07:00:58 -0400
>
> Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> writes:
>
>> In that case, it doesn't make too much sense to me to add it to ELPA,
>> but not for the reasons that you give.  It's not that code which is
>> targeting emacs.git cannot go on ELPA first, but it seems to me that
>> anything on ELPA should be a coherent, singular package.  And Agitate
>> isn't that -- it's a collection of functionality that you're filtering
>> things out of over time.
>
> FWIW, I don't think this is a very strong reason not to add it.  Other
> packages are also grab bags of features, and while perhaps not "ideal"
> in an abstract sense, they also provide useful functionality.  In this
> case it also makes sense to me to use a package as a way to experiment
> with features before they hit core.
>
> We can always delete the package later, once it has done its intended
> job and is fully absorbed by Emacs.

Okay.  I will add the package and promise to delete it when necessary.
There will not be a formal release for the time being.  I will keep it
at version 0.0.0 so only those using GNU ELPA Devel will find it.

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Protesilaos Stavrou <info@protesilaos.com>
> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 08:52:57 +0300

> [... 22 lines elided]

> Okay.  I will add the package and promise to delete it when necessary.
> There will not be a formal release for the time being.  I will keep it
> at version 0.0.0 so only those using GNU ELPA Devel will find it.

Apparently Stefan Monnier got there first:

    commit 15be327b7a9befe315903bb2ea19d0282ad678ba
    Author: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
    Date:   Wed Sep 28 16:45:26 2022 -0400

      * elpa-packages (agitate): New package

https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/elpa.git/commit/?id=15be327b7a9befe315903bb2ea19d0282ad678ba

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Stefan Monnier]

> Okay.  I will add the package and promise to delete it when necessary.
> There will not be a formal release for the time being.  I will keep it
> at version 0.0.0 so only those using GNU ELPA Devel will find it.

Version 0.0.0 is not the same as version 0, so it doesn't prevent GNU
ELPA from making a release.  If you don't want a release, then use
version 0 or a version of the form <blabla>-git or <blabla>-snapshot.

So far the 0.0.0 release was not made in GNU ELPA simply because the
process that builds the tarball fails :-)


        Stefan

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Protesilaos Stavrou]

> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> Date: Sat,  1 Oct 2022 18:19:35 -0400
>
>> Okay.  I will add the package and promise to delete it when necessary.
>> There will not be a formal release for the time being.  I will keep it
>> at version 0.0.0 so only those using GNU ELPA Devel will find it.
>
> Version 0.0.0 is not the same as version 0, so it doesn't prevent GNU
> ELPA from making a release.  If you don't want a release, then use
> version 0 or a version of the form <blabla>-git or <blabla>-snapshot.

Thank you!  I updated it to 0.

> So far the 0.0.0 release was not made in GNU ELPA simply because the
> process that builds the tarball fails :-)

Gotcha!

-- 
Protesilaos Stavrou
https://protesilaos.com

Re: [ELPA] Add Agitate package

[Richard Stallman]

[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider    ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies,     ]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]

What does the Agitate package do?
Send political emails?

-- 
Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org)
Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org)
Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org)
Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)