From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Changed outside --> set, in Customize UI Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:01:36 -0500 Message-ID: <874qgoo4j7.fsf-monnier+emacs@gnu.org> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1107786367 15131 80.91.229.6 (7 Feb 2005 14:26:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:26:07 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Emacs-Devel Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Feb 07 15:26:01 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Cy9pv-0005RR-00 for ; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 15:26:00 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1CyA3u-0007Y7-PY for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:40:26 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Cy9sa-0001O7-QU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:28:44 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Cy9nk-0007pX-J4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:23:53 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Cy9ni-0007kA-65 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:23:42 -0500 Original-Received: from [209.226.175.74] (helo=tomts20-srv.bellnexxia.net) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Cy9SL-0008Op-Uj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:01:38 -0500 Original-Received: from alfajor ([65.92.240.235]) by tomts20-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.10 201-253-122-130-110-20040306) with ESMTP id <20050207140137.QECA2034.tomts20-srv.bellnexxia.net@alfajor>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 09:01:37 -0500 Original-Received: by alfajor (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 3EAF5D7343; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 09:01:36 -0500 (EST) Original-To: "Drew Adams" In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:35:05 -0800") User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/21.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:33004 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:33004 > One problem mentioned is that trying to save a "changed-outside" > option might not "work": some library you load might change the saved > value to something different after you restart. Well, _setting_ an > option in Customize and then saving it might not work either - for > exactly the same reason. If users think they can rely on _not_ seeing > a changed-outside "warning", then they are misled. If you see a > changed-outside warning, beware; if you don't see such a warning, > beware. This is a distinction without a distinction. Nice theory, but in practice there is a big difference, because in most cases the "changes outside customize" either always take place or never take place, so it's a rare occurrence when the problem you mention shows up. And even if it does show up, taking a look at the customize buffer when you see the problem will tell you "changed outside customize" warning you of the problem. What is the problem you are trying to solve, really? I.e. in what way is the message "changed outside customize" a problem? Stefan