From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: redisplay system of emacs Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:52:38 +0100 Organization: Organization?!? Message-ID: <874om3g8zt.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> References: <27349166.post@talk.nabble.com> <87vdem8gly.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87k4v1xm4l.fsf@gmail.com> <83sk9prvnd.fsf@gnu.org> <87k4v1vz5f.fsf@gmail.com> <9de1a5ef1001300234l53e241bav649e127ea69ff80e@mail.gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1264848798 30352 80.91.229.12 (30 Jan 2010 10:53:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:53:18 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 30 11:53:14 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NbAwz-0006PJ-SI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:53:14 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38354 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NbAwz-0008OW-DT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 05:53:13 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NbAwr-0008OR-2W for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 05:53:05 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=36310 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NbAwp-0008OJ-NV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 05:53:03 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NbAwo-0000Tl-Co for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 05:53:03 -0500 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:59794) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NbAwn-0000TZ-Ie for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 05:53:01 -0500 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NbAwk-0006I0-R0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:52:58 +0100 Original-Received: from p5b2c1f67.dip.t-dialin.net ([91.44.31.103]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:52:58 +0100 Original-Received: from dak by p5b2c1f67.dip.t-dialin.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 30 Jan 2010 11:52:58 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 44 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: p5b2c1f67.dip.t-dialin.net X-Face: 2FEFf>]>q>2iw=B6, xrUubRI>pR&Ml9=ao@P@i)L:\urd*t9M~y1^:+Y]'C0~{mAl`oQuAl \!3KEIp?*w`|bL5qr,H)LFO6Q=qx~iH4DN; i"; /yuIsqbLLCh/!U#X[S~(5eZ41to5f%E@'ELIi$t^ Vc\LWP@J5p^rst0+('>Er0=^1{]M9!p?&:\z]|;&=NP3AhB!B_bi^]Pfkw User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.1.90 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:hG0Nok+RggsdiEIjwhWSmr4aNVg= X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:120683 Archived-At: Fabian Ezequiel Gallina writes: > 2010/1/29 Stefan Monnier : >> >> So, yes, it's probably fairly easy to do an Emacs-like editor using >> another extension language etc... and the result is likely to be >> cleaner, more efficient, better maintained code in many ways. >> Actually such Emacs-like editors exist, using extension languages >> like CommonLisp, OCaml, Haskell, Python, younameit. >> >> The problem is that they're not Emacs, so they start with a small >> user community and it's hard for them to grow.  At some point, I've >> considered the possibility to switch to one of those (where the >> extension language is statically typed ;-), but ... they didn't have >> PCL-CVS, diff-mode, Gnus, ... so it was really an uphill battle. >> Maybe later. > > I think Emacs Lisp is a great extension language. I don't think so. It is a functional language used in a procedural style, causing permanent changes as its ultimate purpose. Not even with lexical bindings. It does automatic allocation and garbage collection, is concise and with data structures catered to the task at hand. Mostly. If it were a great extension language, it would be in use outside of Emacs. Things like Lua would meet the bill quite better, but they are too late in the game now. Emacs is not a program, it is an ecosystem. And ecosystems play by different rules than individuals. Emacs has not yet reached equilibrium, the state where bit rot destroys functionality at the same pace as new stuff gets added. Moving that ecosystem to a different language is about as ambitious as moving a carbon-based ecosystem to silicon-based. You don't know where to start. -- David Kastrup