From: Nix <nix@esperi.org.uk>
To: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
Cc: "Stephen J. Turnbull" <stephen@xemacs.org>,
Emacs development discussions <emacs-devel@gnu.org>,
Daniel Hackney <dan@haxney.org>, Eli Barzilay <eli@barzilay.org>,
Dani Moncayo <dmoncayo@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Proposal to improve the nomenclature of scrolling directions
Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2012 17:33:19 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <874nl0ov8g.fsf@spindle.srvr.nix> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <jwv1ug4an0w.fsf-monnier+emacs@gnu.org> (Stefan Monnier's message of "Wed, 07 Nov 2012 20:49:18 -0500")
On 8 Nov 2012, Stefan Monnier spake thusly:
>> (This model is also why I use Eli Barzilay's wonderfully simple
>> scroll-in-place implementation, which I really should contribute to
>> upstream Emacs one of these years: I had Eli's go-ahead nearly two years
>
> Hadn't heard about it. I just looked at
> https://github.com/elibarzilay/eliemacs/blob/master/include/scroll-in-place.el
> and IIUC all it does is to remember the previous positions during
> a sequence of scroll commands, and to use them when scrolling back.
Yeah. That version's improved a bit over what I'm using -- it's
respecting the old scroll-in-place variable now, so Gnus shouldn't need
changing at all.
Compared to what XEmacs's scroll-in-place has to do (basically a rewrite
of the entire scrolling code, in Lisp, and it still doesn't entirely
work) it is enormously better. 99% of the work is delegated to the
original scrolling code.
I'm honestly not sure how anyone can tolerate Emacs's default scrolling
behaviour -- I've used something like scroll-in-place for my entire life
with Emacs, the default was so hard to handle. I can't imagine that
anyone actually *wants* page-up/page-down sequences to leave you in a
different place from where you were before, but Emacs users are
conservative old sods so it is likely that a lot of users prefer it. So
the default should surely not change.
> It could also be used to let the user go back to where she was before
> scrolling (to simulate those other editors where point is not moved to
> stay visible while scrolling, so that non-scrolling commands teleport
> you right back to where you were).
Ah. That's an interesting variation. Controlled by (setq scroll-in-place
'unmoving) perhaps? (It should probably hide the cursor while it's
conceptually offscreen as well, on terminals where that's possible, by
flipping cursor-type to nil. Alas this would make it vanish from
non-selected windows too, if cursor-in-non-selected-windows is t...)
I'll look into adding 'unmoving support and post the result this
weekend.
I can remove the rebinding hacks and fold it into the core directly, if
you prefer, removing the SIP-orig-scroll-up / SIP-orig-scroll-down hack
and migrating most of the rest into simple.el or scrolling.el or
something like that, so that all that is needed to turn it on is (setq
scroll-preserve-screen-position 'in-place). Or I can just leave it as an
add-on. (That seems less elegant, but is probably best to start with.)
I have a copyright assignment on file, and my employer (Oracle) signed a
disclaimer long ago. I'm not sure about Eli. (Cc:ed.)
--
NULL && (void)
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2012-11-08 17:33 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 97+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2012-11-04 14:10 Proposal to improve the nomenclature of scrolling directions Dani Moncayo
2012-11-04 14:37 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-04 15:00 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-04 17:07 ` Juanma Barranquero
2012-11-04 17:30 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-04 17:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-04 17:35 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-04 18:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-04 19:10 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-04 19:39 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-04 20:01 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-05 11:07 ` Richard Stallman
2012-11-05 12:25 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-05 14:56 ` Nix
2012-11-05 15:39 ` Teemu Likonen
2012-11-07 8:12 ` Harald Hanche-Olsen
2012-11-13 9:05 ` Bastien
2012-11-13 17:05 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-05 3:29 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2012-11-05 7:27 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-05 12:44 ` Jambunathan K
2012-11-05 2:44 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-05 7:24 ` Dani Moncayo
2012-11-05 23:32 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-06 21:29 ` Daniel Hackney
2012-11-05 11:06 ` Richard Stallman
2012-11-05 15:00 ` Nix
2012-11-06 1:25 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2012-11-06 17:24 ` Adrian Robert
2012-11-06 17:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-06 17:50 ` Drew Adams
2012-11-06 19:14 ` John Yates
2012-11-05 18:05 ` Daniel Hackney
2012-11-06 1:53 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2012-11-07 16:31 ` Nix
2012-11-08 1:49 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-08 17:33 ` Nix [this message]
2012-11-08 18:14 ` Eli Barzilay
2012-11-08 18:18 ` Nix
2012-11-08 18:39 ` Eli Barzilay
2012-11-08 18:39 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-09 9:50 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-09 14:18 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-08 18:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-08 18:48 ` Juanma Barranquero
2012-11-08 19:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-09 2:52 ` Richard Stallman
2012-11-09 7:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-09 14:20 ` Nix
2012-11-09 14:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-09 20:24 ` Nix
2012-11-10 11:09 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 11:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 14:11 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 0:13 ` Richard Stallman
2012-11-10 7:42 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 11:09 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 11:45 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 11:48 ` Nix
2012-11-10 14:38 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 14:47 ` Nix
2012-11-10 14:10 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 14:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 18:50 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 19:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 11:10 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 11:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 14:12 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-09 9:51 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-09 14:19 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-10 11:05 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-08 7:18 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2012-11-08 11:12 ` Stephen Leake
2012-11-08 15:43 ` Drew Adams
2012-11-08 17:35 ` Nix
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2012-11-06 17:55 Dmitry Gutov
2012-11-07 0:53 ` Richard Stallman
2012-11-07 15:17 ` Drew Adams
2012-11-07 16:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-07 18:03 ` Drew Adams
2012-11-07 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-07 21:00 ` Drew Adams
2012-11-07 21:17 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-08 22:18 ` Daniel Hackney
2012-11-07 21:12 ` Mathias Dahl
2012-11-07 21:41 ` Dmitry Gutov
2012-11-08 19:26 ` Bruce Korb
2012-11-13 9:07 ` Bastien
[not found] <201211080338.qA83c7NY006393@winooski.ccs.neu.edu>
[not found] ` <20635.16010.769769.433949@winooski.ccs.neu.edu>
2012-11-08 16:48 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-09 9:50 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-09 14:17 ` Stefan Monnier
2012-11-09 15:27 ` Eli Barzilay
2012-11-10 11:05 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 11:38 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 14:09 ` martin rudalics
2012-11-10 14:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2012-11-10 18:49 ` martin rudalics
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