From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Matt Armstrong Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Help sought understanding shorthands wrt modules/packages Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2022 10:22:44 -0800 Message-ID: <874jv8m1hn.fsf@rfc20.org> References: <87r0yemgt2.fsf@rfc20.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="6696"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Helmut Eller , Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 09 19:24:16 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ospkF-0001ZR-D3 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2022 19:24:15 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ospj4-0000yQ-DK; Wed, 09 Nov 2022 13:23:02 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ospj2-0000ur-EA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2022 13:23:00 -0500 Original-Received: from relay1-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.193]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ospix-0006SL-T0; Wed, 09 Nov 2022 13:23:00 -0500 Original-Received: (Authenticated sender: matt@rfc20.org) by mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EB4A8240004; Wed, 9 Nov 2022 18:22:47 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rfc20.org; s=gm1; t=1668018168; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=0oX/ZTb8hf+FcFBbx0YsANWInZc9t5GWnWXsTiQYW+4=; b=jrcRG8JMvHAiZoBnn2HpfBSlTutljKEPDNFlYwOCdw70D0rbi20/Hh7gj9ypYnFzJf+fzI kKpWONLd1dbPGXLma1zeiEYut8O22KJ1T6Vq357oTWsrO3wM7B41II2JJ7ZtEpuhRo6w7E 4mPSGa3gM+JBj0NxRct1IcWcae4iQb34bXVjAXrk7E0PFhEthM/kTU/3k0yoX3ZBOqYDd4 6WRmbuoy5Kw5KFq0pCdvplaPxuDV8GXt3Xq9yUWnHZ0zB0NHrSR1Wkyp5/QL1GEewI4VCw Hl6zI+Hf+ORPqUuTtvELHQA5pw+hbBRU5KDb0Qbb0rK5Po5khHGNJ/0b6PXO6A== Original-Received: from matt by naz with local (Exim 4.96) (envelope-from ) id 1ospin-001sBr-02; Wed, 09 Nov 2022 10:22:45 -0800 In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.70.183.193; envelope-from=matt@rfc20.org; helo=relay1-d.mail.gandi.net X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:299422 Archived-At: Helmut Eller writes: > On Tue, Nov 08 2022, Richard Stallman wrote: > >> Making it even worse, once BAR:HACK is recorded as the meaning of HACK >> in FOO's symbol table (obarray), there was no way to make it mean some >> other symbol HACK. > > That's technically wrong: it is possibly to "shadow" inherited symbols. Yes, Common Lisp apparently grew mitigations for the pitfalls of :use/use-package after Richard had experience with them. I do not think the pitfalls went away, though.