From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ted Zlatanov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: package.el, auto-installation, and auto-removal Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:59:31 -0500 Organization: =?utf-8?B?0KLQtdC+0LTQvtGAINCX0LvQsNGC0LDQvdC+0LI=?= @ Cienfuegos Message-ID: <87389qe92k.fsf@lifelogs.com> References: <87a943umku.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87ppcvm7fj.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> <87vbmndk46.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87bnoeed7v.fsf@lifelogs.com> Reply-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1415674800 27037 80.91.229.3 (11 Nov 2014 03:00:00 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2014 03:00:00 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Nov 11 03:59:50 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1gL-0008Lo-EN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Nov 2014 03:59:49 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46515 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1gL-0001cB-1V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:59:49 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51514) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1g1-0001bp-FQ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:59:35 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1fu-0004OA-Mm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:59:29 -0500 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:46604) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1fu-0004Nz-GW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:59:22 -0500 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Xo1ft-000880-A4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Nov 2014 03:59:21 +0100 Original-Received: from c-98-229-61-72.hsd1.ma.comcast.net ([98.229.61.72]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 2014 03:59:21 +0100 Original-Received: from tzz by c-98-229-61-72.hsd1.ma.comcast.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 2014 03:59:21 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-Lines: 38 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-98-229-61-72.hsd1.ma.comcast.net X-Face: bd.DQ~'29fIs`T_%O%C\g%6jW)yi[zuz6; d4V0`@y-~$#3P_Ng{@m+e4o<4P'#(_GJQ%TT= D}[Ep*b!\e,fBZ'j_+#"Ps?s2!4H2-Y"sx" Mail-Copies-To: never User-Agent: Gnus/5.130012 (Ma Gnus v0.12) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:0NZjKLPgGLNO9WBc3852nClFq0c= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:176735 Archived-At: On Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:26:14 -0500 Stefan Monnier wrote: >> I provided URLs to Pallet's repo on Github and to Nic's comparison of >> Cask (which Pallet uses underneath) and elpakit (the comparison is on >> the elpakit repo home page, also on Github). I described how Pallet >> currently works with advice and how it could be improved to use hooks. >> Sorry if I didn't explain things better. What's unclear? SM> I guess I just don't understand what those things do, nor how they do SM> it, and your explanations didn't really help. Sorry. SM> E.g. does one of those things make it so that M-x package-install will SM> add the package to some list of "explicitly installed packages"? SM> If so, which tool, and how does it do it? AFAICT it can only do that SM> via advice currently. Of course, it can be changed to use hooks, but SM> why bother, when we can just modify package-install directly? Pallet hooks (through advice) into package installations, plus it can discover the starting list of packages. It then maintains a Cask file. So it does what you asked for at the beginning of this thread, but relays the actual package management to Cask. I agree that the integration of (Pallet|elpakit) can be as tight as we want, no need for hooks. Cask manages a list of packages in an external file. It's aware of dependencies, repos, etc. and is quite popular for its ease of use. As Phillip Lord said, bundling Cask would remove its Python requirement and perhaps improve the user experience with package.el and the various ELPAs. I would love to hear from people that actively use Pallet/Cask or elpakit. I've used el-get and use-package over the last few years, and tried Pallet/Cask only recently as I heard about them from friends. Ted