From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bill Wohler Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Why Emacs needs a modern bug tracker Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 23:00:48 -0800 Organization: Newt Software Message-ID: <871w8o7snz.fsf@olgas.newt.com> References: <20080104164454.0A4BD830697@snark.thyrsus.com> <20080105182456.GR30869@thyrsus.com> <20080105214810.GZ30869@thyrsus.com> <20080105233923.GH30869@thyrsus.com> <18304.10442.537860.246188@kahikatea.snap.net.nz> <87k5mnoge1.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <8763y7o719.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87r6gt7l7i.GNU's_Not_Unix!%yavor@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1200034877 2179 80.91.229.12 (11 Jan 2008 07:01:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 07:01:17 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Peter Galbraith To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 11 08:01:39 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JDDtZ-0000Ms-JA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 08:01:37 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JDDtB-0004si-Ij for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:01:13 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JDDt6-0004pW-I9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:01:08 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JDDt4-0004mT-T8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:01:08 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JDDt4-0004mE-Mg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:01:06 -0500 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JDDt4-0002WY-49 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:01:06 -0500 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1JDDsx-0001py-Jr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 07:00:59 +0000 Original-Received: from h-66-167-77-75.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net ([66.167.77.75]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 07:00:59 +0000 Original-Received: from wohler by h-66-167-77-75.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2008 07:00:59 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 79 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: h-66-167-77-75.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:eNsypANwzBPjDSXzOnAihmi9/mw= X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:86730 Archived-At: Yavor Doganov writes: > I guess that the most reasonable course of action is: Those that > promote the idea of a bug tracking system make a research of all > available solutions (debbugs, Trac with the email support plugin, > GNATS, the GCC Bugzilla, etc.) and prepare a comparison list with > advantages/disatvantages, so that Emacs developers can discuss based > on it and eventually decide which BTS is the most appropriate one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_issue_tracking_systems Richard Stallman writes: > If we are to use a bug tracker, it must allow people to do everything > thru email if they wish to, and must make that mode convenient. > It sounds like a plausible candidate. Whether it is really ok in practice > depends on the details of what using it is like. I think you'd really like debbugs (Debian BTS), Richard, for the same reasons I love it (as a user). It's completely driven via email and has few knobs and whistles. Documentation about debbugs and a simple reporting form can be found at: http://www.us.debian.org/Bugs/ As a user, I submit bugs from Emacs using `M-x debian-bug' (written by Peter Galbraith, a Debian maintainer and a Emacs committer as well). Like report-emacs-bug, it fills in the necessary pseudo-headers and environment information. Unlike report-emacs-bug, it also provides completion for the package or pseudo-package (which would also be useful within Emacs) and menu items to manipulate the pseudo-headers (Severity, Tags, etc.) and to view other bugs for the same package. Instead of submitting a new bug, I might see that a bug has already been posted and can add new information to it, simply by replying to the message. At that point the dialog is completely performed in email, and the best part, I get email when the bug is closed so I'll know when to look for the fix. The metadata for the bug are controlled by the developer with pseudo-headers in an email. Peter, are there other Emacs tools to manipulate control messages? > That sounds ok, so far. Can you show me what a couple of these > messages look like? A list of all bugs in the Emacs package: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=emacs22;dist=unstable A bug report that goes from start to finish and shows pseudo-headers. http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=456235 Martin Geisler writes: > People how know the bug tracker better can probably also comment on > whether or not it can be used outside Debian at all, or if it is too > heavily tied to the Debian infrastructure to be useful elsewhere. It seems so since it appears as a package (the tarball is available from the following link): http://packages.debian.org/lenny/debbugs Peter, can you speak to that? p.s. This thread can be referenced via http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/86069/ -- Bill Wohler http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD