From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Karl Fogel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: On being web-friendly and why info must die Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2014 15:13:32 -0600 Message-ID: <871tod241v.fsf@ktab.red-bean.com> References: <20141205123549.GA29331@thyrsus.com> <87mw72lyzs.fsf@earlgrey.lan> <20141205190925.GA5067@thyrsus.com> Reply-To: Karl Fogel NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1417814034 20394 80.91.229.3 (5 Dec 2014 21:13:54 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 21:13:54 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Christopher Allan Webber , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Eric S. Raymond" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Dec 05 22:13:48 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Xx0CB-0002s0-Pw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 22:13:47 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52478 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xx0CB-00049u-Cb for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 16:13:47 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42957) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xx0C5-00049O-4L for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 16:13:45 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xx0C1-0008BI-2U for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 16:13:41 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-ig0-x231.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4001:c05::231]:36587) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xx0C0-0008B8-Tf for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 16:13:36 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-ig0-f177.google.com with SMTP id z20so1434613igj.16 for ; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 13:13:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:reply-to:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=9rgHlUo+msX6vOw3ayy031ubznsy5w6IFF/a50NQjkc=; b=sbAMORqbnQviSKaMro9+SVLdKitOlKXTeFqRdTHZXL7M2JnTZO9rsEwWjPHm857B/9 LYDXeuQ3S9yL3aujVLruYqhjnajhkDx7IWz6JCeJ4xw42IEcGIkdhCujVdIvCBlWjyYm TB+yqmzgrFuNiqyy9suvwzUXeknOZbnVSsRnD5FP+F24TCD0qY8OFcAWzxkEyUlY2eZ+ N7h3718pqFTrJhZSHA2kP4+gC9UGFxODTIUqaEFATcsoPPsxDUc7Ey+G8+teFHWxV4+O HqtiupuH3NZLdI0QWP8UNPSPbPReKO7/A4ajqjsgeA0vXsrhV70oF75isdmTwk/ijKrA r7SQ== X-Received: by 10.50.134.101 with SMTP id pj5mr4531562igb.28.1417814014524; Fri, 05 Dec 2014 13:13:34 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from ktab.red-bean.com (74-92-190-113-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net. [74.92.190.113]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id p137sm16536403ioe.29.2014.12.05.13.13.33 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 05 Dec 2014 13:13:33 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20141205190925.GA5067@thyrsus.com> (Eric S. Raymond's message of "Fri, 5 Dec 2014 14:09:25 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4001:c05::231 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:179012 Archived-At: "Eric S. Raymond" writes: >Christopher Allan Webber : >> Here's where I'm a bit surprised... I'm not sure that new GNU projects >> should have to use Texinfo, but why not put efforts into improving >> Texinfo's HTML output? > >Because Texinfo is a barrier in itself, full of ceremony and heavyweight >markup. The state of the art has moved well past it - modern formats >like asciidoc (or perhaps even org - others may be right about that) >are both lighter and more powerful. +1 on Org, Asciidoc, Markdown, or any other format that meets the criteria: - Raw source is readable as-is - Has free software tools to generate good HTML (and we then treat HTML as the default output format) - Markup syntax is not burdensome Equally important would be getting a situation where Emacs developers can also easily edit the Emacs web pages at gnu.org (which by virtue of URL will always have an officiality advantage for developers seeking information, so we should use that advantage to our... advantage), by having those pages be generated from markup source in our tree. Actually, I think that might be *more* important than the exact choice of markup language. I hope we don't bikeshed.com the choice of markup language to death. ${ANYTHING_STANDARD_OR_ORG} is fine by me. -K