From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Llu=C3=ADs?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: IDE Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2015 15:02:54 +0200 Message-ID: <871tcyexa9.fsf@fimbulvetr.bsc.es> References: <5610207A.2000300@harpegolden.net> <83fv1r3gzp.fsf@gnu.org> <83bncf3f9k.fsf@gnu.org> <5610E0BC.8090902@online.de> <83si5r106e.fsf@gnu.org> <831td9z18h.fsf@gnu.org> <5612E996.7090700@yandex.ru> <83bnc7tavr.fsf@gnu.org> <5618C92A.3040207@yandex.ru> <83a8rrt9ag.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1444741458 28265 80.91.229.3 (13 Oct 2015 13:04:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2015 13:04:18 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, adatgyujto@gmail.com, Dmitry Gutov To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 13 15:04:02 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZlzFK-0005Er-4Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 15:04:02 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:34510 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZlzFJ-0008OW-FS for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 09:04:01 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:49585) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZlzEM-0007rB-LG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 09:03:03 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZlzEI-0005Zv-86 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 09:03:02 -0400 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:50542) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZlzEI-0005Za-2Z; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 09:02:58 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost ([84.88.51.85]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LzcIM-1ahzgA0MRG-014olm; Tue, 13 Oct 2015 15:02:56 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83a8rrt9ag.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 10 Oct 2015 11:30:47 +0300") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:hwbnswJnAgRms0NSR7zsMGy8xK1uEj4hvCKY5RjqloOojLQH3g8 47NY8rxMMaB9NSvUvhab0meP9zMWbyBiAqYJEjqs23WoLjQ24nRYaYKQbuweKtSAaPdrn6N 0zD27b1lZ6VpmE4/IP56cpYxe9aqoZGD8niksQdDr9bS+8tjruMcTolF6xceWdoW7dSOHb/ 1g3JAweIVBL+erLM9hnvQ== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:wlH0hRgV9O8=:a0WjQSxwTM7aPtRHDn8lKO M/rrSNhrvf8GRNyky6cwrDxicrkhuOn310E2CI0t9X5fzFYx3kEtY/qS2fWOST7K3IdN2mjNG gJyWOJgMbRoEZLOpfIp2K8Yw0IBD9lAzq9TaMvEb4QMQspLpk2LH4a//xXUcn/R+LvRedyvpO IyqHoPlEwgckFBQfWoxsuq5tk+sA1KGCt2nLKz+6628Guen1Y92YM5mgkAVjnNzF7bZ+a7SDj dgoTxVfErsnx3EG8HfSAbaq36oRn1EBdLIZVLzCKLWGfdOIlMKL1TO/8N77m7unFLCONx/PWn VtG7uyDq5tXSJ1GN37Yktnz1mLUhHMeMA+GK3MDfUoP937LmZw+3mtddmP65FafjH0SwEB4C+ 7cCDdZ9/F1TnnsMGBkK5ceIKL9X0wWa9XvoZcmRoKrPla1wcErYEW5Ytk5FZ8eXe7ExYu28ZZ 9wPeGQ4w32QX9W6KfvLpgMIcF+nTqBFG0h3BP9dvWOQ3K2FAfU32Y94ocITCmqdwi8bmN7RQX tbqkIXafd0GGXvroRZJNC3rRJdCtdGwjSUs2xDbPLAIQ+hUz/XdLhwhqLmNeKMxWcLTsicXf6 wlsaUIAe7R7aF3lUQYaacytwlcpfrOK2FAyyC4cNhew6C7JlCTqZrWgP5tKy1r4XcnXcipqeZ /AZNGJft31y+ULwmZ3CoLnab+6OUTvcTH8yU9gtSPdD99oYWEWKqLP3KrK9S335pY5MVwkQ7h iRhui0ZmMDjrClsHPq896BMTL8hlv8VADwbUOaEh6B0QhVEy+66iqoLDxhg5k3cB5boozSgD X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 212.227.15.19 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:191453 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: [...] >> For C/C++, the community has Irony and Rtags, both based on libclang. If >> libclang is unacceptable for you, you probably know a more appropriate >> mailing list to bring that up at. > Let's not reiterate past discussions: you forget CEDET. Just thinking out loud: it seems to me that many people forget that CEDET is, from my understanding, a framework for writing tools first, and a set of such example tools later. > And if anyone _really_ cares about supporting C/C++, they should be > working with and on GCC's libcc1, which is available for quite some > time already. If this is the libgcc1 you mean [1], I'm not sure it's suitable for code completion. Instead, GCC should be modified to hook into the frontend parser or the generic AST and then parsing that, which is no small feat. Fortunately, hooking is already possible using GCC plugins [2]. [1] http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gccint/Libgcc.html [2] http://www.codesynthesis.com/~boris/blog/2010/05/03/parsing-cxx-with-gcc-plugin-part-1/ With this, it's a relatively easy (but time-consuming) task to build an external tool that parses files on-demand. The ideal would be some kind of persistent daemon+database, as was discussed in the CEDET list quite some time ago, but that's an entirely different story. [...] >> Would you expect the programs mentioned above to become a part of Emacs? > I expect to see a coherent, orchestrated effort towards having an IDE > mode in Emacs. I don't see it, certainly not in discussions on this > list. I also don't see any commits that would provide evidence of > such an effort. > If such activities happen somewhere else, I would suggest their > participants to come here and work with and within the core. For > starters, I don't imagine they would succeed without some significant > changes and additions in the core infrastructure. The place to > discuss that is here. I think that things are happening outside (completion, automatic project detection, etc) because there is no common goal on what features should be available and through what interface. This, and that giving an opinion on these topics is way much less work than actually implementing them (and I include myself on the first group of non-implementors). Cheers, Lluis -- "And it's much the same thing with knowledge, for whenever you learn something new, the whole world becomes that much richer." -- The Princess of Pure Reason, as told by Norton Juster in The Phantom Tollbooth