From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Marcin Borkowski Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Some ideas with Emacs Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2019 21:55:00 +0100 Message-ID: <871rtb99zv.fsf@mbork.pl> References: <87fthx9ui8.fsf@mbork.pl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="123114"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: mu4e 1.1.0; emacs 27.0.50 Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ag Ibragimov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Dec 10 21:56:21 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1iemYN-000VqV-Kr for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 21:56:19 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35912 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iemYM-0007Gy-Ej for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 15:56:18 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59423) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iemXN-00075X-Vj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 15:55:19 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iemXM-0004fC-Jq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 15:55:17 -0500 Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([195.110.48.8]:33064) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iemXM-0004Yh-BM for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 15:55:16 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC897E6D72; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 21:55:06 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at mail.mojserwer.eu Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.mojserwer.eu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LDf7ncp5qbIA; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 21:55:03 +0100 (CET) Original-Received: from localhost (jeden09-dwa27.echostar.pl [213.156.109.227]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 111EBE6D70; Tue, 10 Dec 2019 21:55:03 +0100 (CET) In-reply-to: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 195.110.48.8 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:243288 Archived-At: On 2019-12-07, at 03:13, Ag Ibragimov wrote: > On Fri 06 Dec 2019 at 10:30, Marcin Borkowski wrote: > >> On 2019-12-03, at 07:07, Ag Ibragimov wrote: >> >>> Ooohweee, I've lost myself in the weeds of this discussion thread. It seems writing a book about Emacs Lisp is an arduous task (no shit), writing a comprehensive manual is not easy either. >>> >>> So I thought: what if we start a repository, make a pitch through social platforms, get people interested, and start collecting various elisp recipes. Then after a while, maybe we could form a curated list. After a few, maybe several months, we gather enough material to make a book out of that? >>> >>> "Emacs Lisp Cookbook" or something? >> >> No. >> >> You may indeed prepare a "cookbook", or a wiki this way - but not >> a _book_. A "book" (as opposed to a wiki, a _cookbook_ or a manual) is >> something that _tells a story_. >> >> Best, > > I agree with that. However, I think "Elisp recipes" or "Elisp cookbook" is exactly what we need and what's missing. > You see, Emacs Lisp usually is not learned traditional way, you don't sit down with a book that slowly explains concepts from the elementary to more advanced topics. Also people don't do emacs-lisp "katas" or "koans". Usually one gets into emacs-lisp when the need arises for solving a problem. It's not that difficult to find help these days, people are always happy to help you, we have r/emacs, mailing lists, emacs.stackexchange, various Gitter, Slack and IRC channels, etc. > But sometimes you don't even know you had a problem, until someone shows you a solution to it. I think that kind of book, collective community effort would be awesome to have. I think that I could agree with that, though I personally like a more structured exposition. > But your point about a book that tells a story is also very valid. It would be absolutely amazing to have a book written by a single person or small group of co-authors, something titled like "Joy of Emacs" ("Joy of GNU/Emacs" if you're so pedantic) where it also describes philosophy of the language, historical context, contemplates about the future of the language, etc. Now that you wrote that, I think this is really an amazing idea. I am a bit afraid I do not know enough about Emacs - and my plan is a bit more humble anyway - but thanks for inspiration. Best, -- Marcin Borkowski http://mbork.pl