From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ted Zlatanov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Patch: enhanced mark navigation commands Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 10:08:49 -0500 Organization: =?utf-8?B?0KLQtdC+0LTQvtGAINCX0LvQsNGC0LDQvdC+0LI=?= @ Cienfuegos Message-ID: <86r6ehqovy.fsf@lifelogs.com> References: <55f7df060803042112w380b5170qe964002c6c06ab01@mail.gmail.com> <86r6ep8821.fsf@lifelogs.com> <86pru96jgl.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87ablcom9a.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <86pru2vi77.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87pru2nslr.fsf@jurta.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1205248098 17101 80.91.229.12 (11 Mar 2008 15:08:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:08:18 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Mar 11 16:08:46 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JZ64d-0001P3-Ke for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:07:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ645-0003IY-7q for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:06:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ641-0003IJ-FT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:06:49 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ63z-0003Hv-KA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:06:48 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ63z-0003Hs-FI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:06:47 -0400 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JZ63z-00042s-BW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:06:47 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ63t-0004Al-3g for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:06:41 +0000 Original-Received: from 38.98.147.130 ([38.98.147.130]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:06:41 +0000 Original-Received: from tzz by 38.98.147.130 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:06:41 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 46 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 38.98.147.130 X-Face: bd.DQ~'29fIs`T_%O%C\g%6jW)yi[zuz6; d4V0`@y-~$#3P_Ng{@m+e4o<4P'#(_GJQ%TT= D}[Ep*b!\e,fBZ'j_+#"Ps?s2!4H2-Y"sx" User-Agent: Gnus/5.110007 (No Gnus v0.7) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:yyNG7paBh+D5r0e6rKx5mm4cP0E= X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:92161 Archived-At: On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 00:34:32 +0200 Juri Linkov wrote: JL> Ted Z wrote: >> After thinking about it, you're right. I still think there's a need for >> more unified navigation commands than the hodge-podge we have in Emacs >> now, but this is not the way to do it. JL> I doubt that it is possible to build a hierarchy of context-dependent JL> navigation layers. Right, that's what I realized when I thought about my suggestion. What's needed is a standard way of navigating that every mode can install quickly and without writing much code. You call (emacs-standard-keys-install 'my-mode-keymap) and everything Just Works. But this is a hard problem that should be solved only if the Emacs maintainers agree it's a problem, since fixing it will require changes to many packages and keybindings. This is related to the discussion on shifted keys and CUA modes. IMHO, motion should be an Emacs standard, and each mode should only customize the things you can navigate, but not the navigation keys themselves. Then users could set up the navigation preferences they want and have them work everywhere. JL> Do you remember how many problems were caused by just two levels of JL> next-error navigation (when next-error from the grep buffer arrives JL> at a diff output file, what the next call to next-error should do: JL> continue visiting grep matches or start visiting diff hunks)? Yes, I remember. DWIM is always harder than it looks. JL> What would be more useful I think is to find a unified key prefix for JL> navigation commands. For instance, `M-g e M-n' would go to the next JL> error, `M-g t M-n' - to the next tag, `M-g d f M-n' - to the next diff JL> file in the diff buffer `M-g d h M-n' - to the next diff hunk in the JL> diff buffer, etc. JL> Of course, sometimes this might be too much to type, but for every JL> next call we could just accept the last key (similar to `C-x z z z') JL> to repeat the last command like `M-g e M-n M-n M-n'. I agree this should be done in a standard way, maybe the way you describe. Ted