From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Alternative defaults for visually impaired users? (was: [RFC] The best way to choose an "action" at point: context-menu-mode, transient, which-key or embark? (was: Fwd: Org-cite: Replace basic follow-processor with transient menu?)) Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2024 15:47:20 +0200 Message-ID: <86plli4il3.fsf@gnu.org> References: <8734m28l9a.fsf@gmail.com> <87wmh8s358.fsf@localhost> <87y11nwp9z.fsf@gmail.com> <87v7wd9a2h.fsf@localhost> <878qt7fbki.fsf@gmail.com> <87o71jwdxz.fsf@localhost> <87wmg6edr0.fsf@gmail.com> <87msgzh1dh.fsf@localhost> <87v7vn12tp.fsf@ASCALON.mail-host-address-is-not-set> <878qsifufe.fsf@localhost> <87y10fcy4e.fsf@localhost> <87cyhpclns.fsf@bernoul.li> <877c7v7dbn.fsf@localhost> <87cyhk9icj.fsf@localhost> <86y1076h23.fsf@gnu.org> <87cyhj7faz.fsf@localhost> <86frmf5z0n.fsf@gnu.org> <87bjx2ls6k.fsf@localhost> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="14315"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: rms@gnu.org, jonas@bernoul.li, samologist@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, karthikchikmagalur@gmail.com, visuweshm@gmail.com, raman@google.com To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 23 14:47:45 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1tPimf-0003bU-BZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 23 Dec 2024 14:47:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tPimU-00088n-Uk; Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:47:34 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tPimR-00088J-Vk for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:47:31 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tPimP-0001Qk-Kc; Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:47:29 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=Mb4Mtw8Q3wOs9nmCtcHzc2ggxCOkiWruLFr2oKTOoAI=; b=iPjhcUwaf/n9 KkUzlrEFjIJkU9gLDEtiVClMLHROY8wHGgvNQLcWFkl07sZsVzPdhpJYuspAnulR8NgjVURBP67Hl l9KcLr26caDvBTFAiZLKPLmEHI/p+ia6Gt58mt3REmhrTTxX9thMDNYcAbp4zXQt8brkgZ0llaQ6B 3Qq7dGgDsO3RPfVjLiuEGTIIicXfFCXarl4JA6F8shNEjp5CtERjA/xNfU2HYVATe+L5d0DHkXUWB SR2oAl72GsXsQTCgOExp76qQrOkWulZSVCHwakqIUiOdFLUXCooGK9tE6wIaGOOvv7PcH0i6hpZHI 5BJJJvOFDteBX152RrZULg==; In-Reply-To: <87bjx2ls6k.fsf@localhost> (message from Ihor Radchenko on Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:28:03 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:326907 Archived-At: > From: Ihor Radchenko > Cc: rms@gnu.org, jonas@bernoul.li, samologist@gmail.com, > emacs-devel@gnu.org, karthikchikmagalur@gmail.com, visuweshm@gmail.com, > raman@google.com > Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:28:03 +0000 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > >> I imagine adding "alternative" default value to `defcustom': > >> > >> (defcustom variable default-value > >> :alt-default > >> (("blind" . value2) > >> ("large-fonts" . value3)) > >> ...) > >> ... > > > > If this means that, for example, each face and defcustom we define > > will need to have such alternatives defined in advance, I think it's a > > non-starter. People will forget to define those, and having such a > > definition for each face/defcustom is extremely inconvenient and hard > > to maintain. > > I believe that only a small subset of options/faces will need to specify > the alternative defaults. Why do you think that _each_ face/defcustom > will require that? Because each face can appear on display, and we want all of them to be visible. Or maybe I'm missing something: why do you think only a small subset of faces and options will need to have special defaults? > > What I think we need is some infrastructure which will automatically > > react to a setting from the accessibility set. For "large fonts", > > this is almost trivial, but other settings might be harder. > > I doubt that such _universal_ infrastructure that will not require > manual intervention can exist wrt Emacs options. Maybe for faces. But > 100% not for user options. If we agree that this is reasonable for faces, we should be able to do that already. As for user options, we should first have an idea what kind of options will need to be affected. If you know, please tell. Then we can discuss what needs to be done about them, and then we could see if some mechanism will be needed or will be useful. > > Perhaps a useful first step would be for someone to see what other > > systems and applications offer in this department, and post the > > findings. Then we could discuss how to incorporate the relevant parts > > into Emacs. > > I CCed Samuel and Raman because they probably know best about > Emacs-specific customization and maybe also about other apps. Thanks.