From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Madhu <enometh@meer.net>
Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: My resignation from Emacs development
Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2024 14:07:22 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <86bjy7o4jp.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <m38qtbsjow.fsf@leonis4.robolove.meer.net> (message from Madhu on Fri, 22 Nov 2024 14:56:39 +0530)
> From: Madhu <enometh@meer.net>
> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2024 14:56:39 +0530
>
>
> * Eli Zaretskii <86ldxbofgw.fsf@gnu.org> :
> Wrote on Fri, 22 Nov 2024 10:11:27 +0200:
> > So no, we are not "gerrymandering", and the reason we don't even
> > consider "reigning in" Stefan is because we see absolutely no problems
> > with his conduct, certainly no malice. And while it is easy to
> > bad-mouth our ways of leading the project "from the fences" by people
> > who are not really involved with the day in and day out hard work on
> > helping this community move forward, and never contributed anything
> > significant to that movement, the truth is very far from these claims.
> > You and Alfred, and even Po Lu, are well advised to tone down your
> > claims, and exercise much more humility when you post such vicious
> > personal attacks on Stefan and others.
>
> I offer the criticism in good faith, not out of any malice for Stefan
> but because I see the direction as being detrimental for the original
> goals of the project.
I was responding to your criticism of the Emacs maintainers. You
expect us to "reign in" Stefan based on your assessment of his
actions, and accuse us of "gerrymandering" because we don't. If your
criticism of Stefan is in good faith, then please limit it to the
changes that Stefan installs and the developments he leads. If we
agree with your criticism, we will certainly act on it. But as long
as we the maintainers disagree with your assessment of Stefan's
activities, you cannot expect us to act against them, and have no
right to reprimand us for not taking those actions.
> (Mis)Characterising criticisms as vicious personal attacks
No such mis-characterization was present in what I wrote.
> and doubling on the claims and refuse to acknowledge the valid
> criticism
Your criticism was indeed valid, but there's no obligation for us to
agree with it.
> I understand your "advice" as a threat that further criticism will
> be cancelled and not dealt with.
There were no threats, none at all. Any criticism is taken seriously
and is considered. But again, don't expect us to agree with
everything you (or anyone else) says.
And I would expect you to tone down your claims because you are not
involved in Emacs maintenance, and so lack both the broad perspective
and the detailed information about what is going on and how decisions
are being made. That doesn't mean you cannot ask tough questions and
offer radically different perspectives on these issues, but please
choose words carefully on the assumption that you might not know
enough to pass definitive judgments.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2024-11-22 12:07 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 45+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2024-11-20 15:13 My resignation from Emacs development Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-20 15:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-20 16:23 ` Christopher Dimech
2024-11-21 6:22 ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-11-21 10:05 ` Christopher Dimech
2024-11-21 11:23 ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-11-21 11:40 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-21 10:29 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-21 12:26 ` Christopher Dimech
2024-11-20 16:42 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2024-11-20 17:04 ` tomas
2024-11-20 21:56 ` Dmitry Gutov
2024-11-21 2:28 ` Stefan Kangas
2024-11-21 12:34 ` Tree-sitter maturity (was: My resignation from Emacs development) Peter Oliver
2024-11-21 13:01 ` My resignation from Emacs development Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-21 13:48 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-21 14:29 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2024-11-22 0:01 ` Po Lu
2024-11-22 7:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-22 8:14 ` Robert Pluim
2024-11-22 8:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-21 16:29 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-22 5:35 ` Adam Porter
2024-11-22 7:24 ` Madhu
2024-11-22 8:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-22 9:26 ` Madhu
2024-11-22 12:07 ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2024-11-22 12:40 ` Stefan Kangas
2024-11-22 13:06 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-22 13:39 ` Stefan Kangas
2024-11-22 14:25 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-22 10:57 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-22 15:36 ` Stefan Kangas
2024-11-22 17:48 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-21 5:59 ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-11-22 11:36 ` Alan Mackenzie
2024-11-22 11:52 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-21 13:39 ` Andrea Corallo
2024-11-21 19:01 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2024-11-21 19:19 ` Christopher Dimech
2024-11-21 19:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-11-21 19:40 ` Jim Porter
2024-11-21 23:57 ` Po Lu
2024-11-22 17:26 ` On committing significant and/or controversial changes (was: My resignation from Emacs development) Ihor Radchenko
2024-11-22 17:47 ` Ship Mints
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