From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stephen Leake Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: On being web-friendly and why info must die Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2014 11:32:05 -0600 Message-ID: <85oarb5s2y.fsf@stephe-leake.org> References: <20141205123549.GA29331@thyrsus.com> <20141205175810.GD3120@thyrsus.com> <87lhmlncb1.fsf@earlgrey.lan> <20141205193643.GB5067@thyrsus.com> <87tx19rd1b.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <20141205215138.GF7784@thyrsus.com> <54823617.4000406@cs.ucla.edu> <83k325195l.fsf@gnu.org> <5482D94B.2070102@cs.ucla.edu> <5484FF31.5010808@cs.ucla.edu> <5485FC59.5030700@cs.ucla.edu> <87388p6glt.fsf@engster.org> <871to9lw6g.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <5486A704.6090305@cs.ucla.edu> <87k321jj4e.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <54876F7F.9000607@cs.ucla.edu> <54877822.1030600@cs.ucla.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1418232852 17454 80.91.229.3 (10 Dec 2014 17:34:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2014 17:34:12 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Dec 10 18:34:06 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl9D-0006uG-H5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 18:33:59 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47054 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl9D-00028E-49 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:33:59 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50245) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl93-00025Q-Vr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:33:55 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl8x-0006Qa-Qh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:33:49 -0500 Original-Received: from gproxy9-pub.mail.unifiedlayer.com ([69.89.20.122]:42624) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl8x-0006QU-JE for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:33:43 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail 14927 invoked by uid 0); 10 Dec 2014 17:33:42 -0000 Original-Received: from unknown (HELO cmgw3) (10.0.90.84) by gproxy9.mail.unifiedlayer.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2014 17:33:42 -0000 Original-Received: from host114.hostmonster.com ([74.220.207.114]) by cmgw3 with id RtXa1p00Z2UdiVW01tYchA; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 10:32:40 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.1 cv=W++rC3mk c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=CQdxDb2CKd3SRg4I0/XZPQ==:117 a=CQdxDb2CKd3SRg4I0/XZPQ==:17 a=DsvgjBjRAAAA:8 a=f5113yIGAAAA:8 a=fNEgcOh0sVsA:10 a=9i_RQKNPAAAA:8 a=hEr_IkYJT6EA:10 a=jrwKn-8xaegA:10 a=A92cGCtB03wA:10 a=OocQHUDgAAAA:8 a=v0AL3NbRAAAA:8 a=8SWx4yu0SYBz9aj-C18A:9 a=h372iOUBO18A:10 Original-Received: from [70.94.38.149] (port=57042 helo=TAKVER) by host114.hostmonster.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1Xyl7V-0006BD-El for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2014 10:32:13 -0700 In-Reply-To: (Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen's message of "Wed, 10 Dec 2014 09:28:01 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.94 (windows-nt) X-Identified-User: {2442:host114.hostmonster.com:stephele:stephe-leake.org} {sentby:smtp auth 70.94.38.149 authed with stephen_leake@stephe-leake.org} X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 69.89.20.122 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:179673 Archived-At: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen writes: > Paul Eggert writes: > >> On 12/09/2014 02:00 PM, Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen wrote: >>> Texinfo 4 is still available, isn't it? I can't recall whether I >>> installed it myself or it was just there, but I found Texinfo 5 >>> unbearable and switched. >> >> And that's a problem. The fact that so many core Emacs contributors >> stick with Texinfo 4 is not only a technical problem (Texinfo 4 >> doesn't check syntax typos as well, it is still quoting 1970s-style, >> etc.), it's a marketing problem as we're giving potential contributors >> the impression that our development process has ossified. > > Yes. The way the Texinfo maintainers dropped the ball here is perhaps > the best argument (so far) for why Emacs should switch to a different > input format. I agree it's the strongest argument; I also agree with Eli that it's not strong enough. I'd be happy to help rewrite texinfo in Ada (which I realize is a free offer, since it's a non-starter :). On the other hand, I just built emacs.info after changing one file. The make time was noticable, but no longer than other make times I encounter daily. I have a fairly fast machine; about three years old, 4 core 2.4 GHz, Windows 7. -- -- Stephe