From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?B?7KGw7ISx67mI?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: dash.el [was: Re: Imports / inclusion of s.el into Emacs] Date: Mon, 11 May 2020 11:59:31 +0900 Message-ID: <85E41CCF-8D56-4878-95CA-4ED7A6B8E40B@icloud.com> References: <0c88192c-3c33-46ed-95cb-b4c6928016e3@default> <87wo5mc04t.fsf@fastmail.fm> <835zd5h6tq.fsf@gnu.org> <87o8qwc88b.fsf@russet.org.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.80.23.2.2\)) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="57157"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Phillip Lord , joostkremers@fastmail.fm, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon May 11 05:00:27 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jXyg7-000EnB-1V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 11 May 2020 05:00:27 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51854 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXyg5-0000z0-Va for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 10 May 2020 23:00:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49262) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXyfL-0000WH-Oq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 10 May 2020 22:59:39 -0400 Original-Received: from pv50p00im-hyfv10011601.me.com ([17.58.6.43]:49210) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXyfJ-0004xS-WC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 10 May 2020 22:59:39 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=icloud.com; s=1a1hai; t=1589165976; bh=MerQtk9M0mM+LKuzRYQuSSUMd2UUFAyVfQFngx+eiVo=; h=Content-Type:Subject:From:Date:Message-Id:To; b=s0aE8xSOBVceVi6LCf1gHLtG9CiZQDemwzBv8Ds+7HioomGHkH4XAeLj3mNwDzOSz WxTVYC6R1zwpuDN5P490T4U4zax3WqMFKWBdFLoTKgqMnV7jPLe1/AFGqV/Cegx2wr M5WqDXp5B3vnnEQ8k7MRIBrW14c4z6iIOaY/XsgA6MN7b8rMgw00CTU3T48YYABfQ3 91z6V1bWti+Gq16u/b8jpccn29r5Q80i8icntj6pdSlECLKmFtPexTocyARBSD2XY9 gJvDuAHh6DzUlQsPaes1d1mXeGcr1qQ9WNbHu34bv3y5gkNA+vGyJRx0Byhb26T84L 1PzmiEqBZLfcA== Original-Received: from [192.168.0.2] (unknown [1.230.108.64]) by pv50p00im-hyfv10011601.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id ED2D0380501; Mon, 11 May 2020 02:59:34 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.80.23.2.2) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.216, 18.0.676 definitions=2020-05-10_11:2020-05-08, 2020-05-10 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=605 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2002250000 definitions=main-2005110021 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=17.58.6.43; envelope-from=pcr910303@icloud.com; helo=pv50p00im-hyfv10011601.me.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/05/10 22:59:36 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer X-Spam_score_int: -15 X-Spam_score: -1.6 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, KHOP_DYNAMIC=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:249751 Archived-At: Richard Stallman 작성: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > >> So "clostring-prepend" > > Rather, 'clos-prepend'. > >> doesn't really achieve anything other than making >> it unreadable. Magnar's clever choice of naming is, I think, one of the >> reasons people like his libraries. Why change a feature and turn it into >> unreadability. > > 'clos-prepend' is not harder to read than 's-prepend'. The problem is that lots of packages use ‘s-prepend’, rather than ‘clos-prepend’. There are too many packages that are blocked on being ELPA because of s.el and f.el (as dash.el is on ELPA). > Ostensibly it is "just an optional package", but if "most packages use it" > it would really be a replacement installed half-way. > > The s- functions, by themselves, are clean. s.el by itself is not a > mess. But Emacs plus s.el is a mess. That’s true. And there was a big previous discussion where some people here tried to explain why people tend to use the s.el functions instead of the Elisp ones, and rename some Elisp functions to make them more sense. But nobody wanted to add s.el into Emacs core, I think everybody would be opposed to that. > It contains 65 functions, similar to the Emacs string functions but > with idiosyncratic incompatibilities scattered throughout. Some of > the changes are good, some are gratuitously bad. Two different string > function interface, the one we developed and the one that was dropped > on us from outside. > > Would we have any say over further development of the s- interface? > I get the impression we would not. > > > > > -- > Dr Richard Stallman > Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) > Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) > Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)