From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: emacs-29 9b775ddc057 1/2: ; * etc/EGLOT-NEWS: Fix wording of last change. Date: Sat, 06 May 2023 13:53:03 +0300 Message-ID: <83zg6hg29c.fsf@gnu.org> References: <168335548287.8529.4912240840977468283@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <20230506064443.56C75C22F15@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <59835735-faa0-4096-e491-35ec92964b7a@gutov.dev> <831qjthhm8.fsf@gnu.org> <715cdac6-83f6-6907-2ff8-3b33381f3487@gutov.dev> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="38885"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 06 12:52:31 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pvFWg-0009vd-2c for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 06 May 2023 12:52:30 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pvFWO-00072n-KT; Sat, 06 May 2023 06:52:12 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pvFWM-00072d-W4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 06 May 2023 06:52:11 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pvFWM-0004SL-Ni; Sat, 06 May 2023 06:52:10 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=OTmufl/EW9kuYhsSu7DE+24d2cc1EBtwSEPNNUupyn0=; b=f9M9AbbIpOH0fpeotFgE Euf3gEm+lQwbbtIb6SpGo4lMBNI3F8wnzSz18C1wThZyUxi3p95WYsFFhwhAO+2k0LgX0n14jipVB xIJ6w/rz0wrrUuGrRGuXX7pf+RDhhzXCLpsAu3hGfO0/EIRR/qhZ+1w1Q2OiGxrOGuEC4ddJR0hYb IZKjAjMNjhl6N4yusrZVSLFTIoDuB2YzWzKRN6rvisLajMZVtuj39c/eRjl1gvdWTtP62k8hMqyms iIp6HApTvo6mBStD6EXhosmXNlinf9pJ5mpwEx9bgEVMnfxxHO9O7e4DbLIXRryKuFB7q9mYmW2bZ Kpr/AMsmPSXovA==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pvFWJ-00050G-Qr; Sat, 06 May 2023 06:52:10 -0400 In-Reply-To: <715cdac6-83f6-6907-2ff8-3b33381f3487@gutov.dev> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Sat, 6 May 2023 13:46:26 +0300) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:305898 Archived-At: > Date: Sat, 6 May 2023 13:46:26 +0300 > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > From: Dmitry Gutov > > On 06/05/2023 13:35, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >> Date: Sat, 6 May 2023 13:14:32 +0300 > >> From: Dmitry Gutov > >> > >> On 06/05/2023 09:44, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >>> +using the more general command 'package-install', which by default > >>> +will not upgrade "built-in" packages, those that come with Emacs. > >> Friendly reminder: while 'M-x package-install' does not upgrade > >> "built-in" packages "by default", it doesn't upgrade any other packages > >> at all, ever. > > Really? so what does package-install do? > > 'M-x package-install' installs a package if it's not already installed. > > >> I'd hate to create an impression in some users that 'package-install' is > >> a suitable instrument to upgrade packages. > > It isn't? then what is it for? > > See above. > > It also _can_ install a newer version of the package if the first > argument is of type 'package-desc', but that's basically an internal > overload, not something that can be user interactively, or easily in the > init script. BTW, the value of package-install-upgrade-built-in has no > effect on that "overload". I'm surprised, to say the least. To recap: . the entire discussion of bug#62720, of which this is fallout, was about allowing package-install to upgrade Eglot, and according to João, that's what package-install did before Emacs 29. Was this all based on a mistake? if so, why no one has said so in all that long argument?? . the text I changed also talks about package-install, and yet you didn't object to it, why? So please forgive me if I don't quite believe my eyes when I read your messages in this matter.