From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.comp.tex.texinfo.general,gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: @dircategory (Re: Translating Emacs manuals is of strategic importance) Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2024 14:06:40 +0200 Message-ID: <83zfxism27.fsf@gnu.org> References: <877ckqa6m5.fsf@yahoo.com> <8734vda9kz.fsf@yahoo.com> <5EC9A02F-DB34-48B6-BD2D-CB9E89A385D0@traductaire-libre.org> <83r0iwuek9.fsf@gnu.org> <837cknvkrx.fsf@gnu.org> <83r0iuuacz.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="15254"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: jean.christophe.helary@traductaire-libre.org, vincent.b.1@hotmail.fr, emacs-devel@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, help-texinfo@gnu.org To: Stefan Kangas Original-X-From: help-texinfo-bounces+gnu-help-texinfo2=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 06 13:07:16 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: gnu-help-texinfo2@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rM5SO-0003lK-EW for gnu-help-texinfo2@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 06 Jan 2024 13:07:16 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rM5S6-0002Kd-Uf; Sat, 06 Jan 2024 07:06:58 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rM5S5-0002Jd-4v; Sat, 06 Jan 2024 07:06:57 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rM5S4-00012S-6F; Sat, 06 Jan 2024 07:06:56 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=GOUiZNIXJyl+lcoG9aDWGDF2W1OAHkaQ8GbSwLjsAHs=; b=j54EVJX7zIdcEJVV9azZ sQJzVekhLiZKf83xMHMJi7nQDRQ9pjUKRmxiKLKpHlCnPzptuBI4r/MwjyO9GqRkYa89JzeUhuf9J tNKOgzSQWxbTzVtDWW/xJEP5oYPKyVv2kzK+w18DXcjSf1M1NoRiV7O55YdLXEkeL8Ntd5Kzup49H yLUsfET7elmRcznpPy4d3UTvfqF9clWosRwMg17QZ30cXB9CiSqUTuTwjH6U0orV4FJy2Ipd8C+6q 0ktR85TcVBL0+4tmq5YxQV2q5FiOSVU56ia27mW2R+wSHu5G49kRdMlprj3Jm0IzJLiq3drRkFIBx OLtmgo6e8MCdPw==; In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 6 Jan 2024 03:57:24 -0800) X-BeenThere: help-texinfo@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the Texinfo documentation system List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-texinfo-bounces+gnu-help-texinfo2=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-texinfo-bounces+gnu-help-texinfo2=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.comp.tex.texinfo.general:3373 gmane.emacs.devel:314612 Archived-At: > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2024 03:57:24 -0800 > Cc: vincent.b.1@hotmail.fr, emacs-devel@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, > help-texinfo@gnu.org > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > >> If that’s the case, what about using “Translated manuals” for now, > >> since the number of translated manuals is very low? > > > > I'd say the other way around: as long as we have very few > > translations, keeping them together with the English version is > > better. > > I'm concerned that they'd get in the way, even if there are only few of > them. How can a couple of manuals get in the way? I think they will be hardly even noticed. > How about using something like `Info-streamline-headings' for this: > > - Put manuals under "Translated manuals" for English locales. > > - Move those relevant to the current locale to "Emacs". > > I'd probably take it a step further and completely hide translations (by > default at least) outside of relevant locales. We already do basically > that for the tutorial. We could do something like that, indeed, but I tend to think this is a matter of user preferences rather than the locale. Why would we assume that only users running in a French locale want to be able to read the French translation? In any case, my proposal was to do something simple as the first step. IMO we should postpone more complicated stuff, like user preferences and locale-dependent magic to later, when the way of handling translations of the manuals is based on discussions and decisions that are not private to Emacs. I feel we are putting the cart ahead of the horses by designing solutions for this at this time.