From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Suggested experimental test Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 19:04:00 +0200 Message-ID: <83tup0jxfj.fsf@gnu.org> References: <936DFE4B-B16D-45A2-A6C2-AF13C451BF39@bydasein.com> <87tup1dk63.fsf@gnus.org> <20210324085114.GC30513@tuxteam.de> <164F3FEC-FBD2-4BD7-A6C4-BD195DC54D50@gnu.org> <20210324111317.GG30513@tuxteam.de> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="10971"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: tomas@tuxteam.de Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Mar 24 18:04:58 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lP6wD-0002j2-QE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2021 18:04:57 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58170 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lP6wC-0004An-Se for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2021 13:04:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50294) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lP6vP-0003ee-Uu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2021 13:04:07 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:60156) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lP6vO-0005qz-7a; Wed, 24 Mar 2021 13:04:06 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:1526 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lP6vN-0008BA-Fx; Wed, 24 Mar 2021 13:04:05 -0400 In-Reply-To: <20210324111317.GG30513@tuxteam.de> (tomas@tuxteam.de) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:266970 Archived-At: > Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 12:13:17 +0100 > From: tomas@tuxteam.de > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > > It's more the intensity of bad feelings on (mostly) both > sides, the "oldtimers" on the one fearing someone's out to > eat their lunch, the "newcomers" on the other, pushing their > new, shiny idea and frustrated that "progress is impossible" > at every (often well-founded!) pushback... well, we see that > time and again. I see no problem with intense feelings, as long as they are expressed in a civilized and polite form. And AFAICT, they generally are in this thread. (The rest of what you wrote above is stuff no one actually said, it looks like your interpretation of the social dynamics here. Which is fine, but it's your interpretation, not necessarily what really goes on. And even if it does, I wouldn't start discussing these aspects, they are only tangentially relevant, and moreover, we cannot really do anything about them.) It is true that we sometimes have discussions here that end up in flames, but this one is not one of them, nowhere near that, actually. Thus, Lars's comment should have been enough to respond to a remark that could have bordered on an insult (although I'm quite sure that was never the intent). No need to second it, not in this thread. Exaggeration in these matters is as bad as indifference, IME. > Now, I think it's OK to have strong feelings about one's > main and favourite tool, but perhaps we could try to develop > some genuine understanding [1] for each other's pain points > and just be a bit... nicer to each other. We do, but don't expect that to be 110% bulletproof, as even the most innocent jokes and wording nuances are known to offend someone, somewhere. The only way never to risk offense is to keep silent.