From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Adding use-package to core Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2022 12:31:01 +0200 Message-ID: <83r0xz8cd6.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87fsemjs7v.fsf@yahoo.com> <87wn7skqne.fsf@melete.silentflame.com> <83h6yw9hhf.fsf@gnu.org> <87h6ywgfii.fsf@posteo.net> <83edtza04u.fsf@gnu.org> <875yfb5rg5.fsf@posteo.net> <834juv9xpm.fsf@gnu.org> <871qpz5k7y.fsf@posteo.net> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7544"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: spwhitton@spwhitton.name, luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, xenodasein@tutanota.de To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 19 11:31:14 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1owL7x-0001mR-Pp for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2022 11:31:13 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1owL7l-0000Ry-5q; Sat, 19 Nov 2022 05:31:01 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1owL7h-0000NZ-90 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2022 05:30:58 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1owL7g-0006wR-IT; Sat, 19 Nov 2022 05:30:56 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=+QKmstNMrwePIrXODdq+dM/LsO/O4B9CPmaV8O4285c=; b=OIq4q3x1/p+l /unJICKsdlUIa45A9VZtfB9PPFDMYst+xcHL+v9ywqO8AH9yO9d/vCQSw4bgt9PB013e5Na5pr5AY HYlm/Uk4K1x1zjzF5qUOMF2/sGBQNsh5q6i+PnOMXwk2641Ln/YuHMW61iOgCcC3JmMFjGzMI16AH Mnx201HVynogfNY8t2z0YRLfGrC5OIhC/UXtk+MQSl8wW/g14/YlVEBaJJ3SkjZ132emHRK99nP7h 1hgN1Krbt3lDpZcq8LXRE36mdSmWIrad5a6h3Szx/PpzAZdwWjvIsvQw7xqXmPwZDYzB/2UITicBO fCuu4sT5DInNmK4p83fp6Q==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1owL7f-0007DD-84; Sat, 19 Nov 2022 05:30:56 -0500 In-Reply-To: <871qpz5k7y.fsf@posteo.net> (message from Philip Kaludercic on Sat, 19 Nov 2022 10:09:37 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:300149 Archived-At: > From: Philip Kaludercic > Cc: spwhitton@spwhitton.name, luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, > xenodasein@tutanota.de > Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2022 10:09:37 +0000 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > >> 2. Are we talking about GNU ELPA or both NonGNU ELPA and GNU ELPA. > > > > GNU ELPA only. > > OK, but then again, what to do about Magit being on NonGNU ELPA. AFAIU, an effort to collect all the assignments for Magit is under way, with the purpose of adding Magit to ELPA and/or Emacs. > > We could do that, but until we have a reliable way of including ELPA > > packages in a release (which should include the solution for how to > > upgrade such packages after the released Emacs is installed on the > > user's machine), doing these secondary jobs is IMO just a waste of > > time and energy. For example, if the solutions are far away in the > > future, the list of contenders you collect now will be outdated by > > then, and will need to be redone anew. > > > > The issues we are touching here were all discussed in the past, and > > the difficulties that need to be resolved were described and also > > discussed. It's nothing new, and I don't think anything's changed > > since those discussions, we are still where we were back then wrt our > > ability to include ELPA packages. > > What exactly is the complication here? Wouldn't it be possible to have > a "contrib"/"elpa"/... directory under lisp with ELPA packages that are > prepared before packaging? Or should these packages be moved into the > core? Would using fancy tricks like git worktrees, as done by > elpa-admin be a possible approach to tackle the issue? The basic issue is: when I install a new Emacs version, and later want to upgrade to a newer version of a package maintained on ELPA, how does Emacs do that, and what are user-level implications, given the existing methods of installing Emacs, both by building it locally and installing a distro? Again, the details of this were described and discussed, so I suggest to look up those past discussions and read there.