From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Abysmal state of GTK build Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2022 15:05:15 +0300 Message-ID: <83pmgr88sk.fsf@gnu.org> References: <8735dn30if.fsf@gmail.com> <87pmgr8m3t.fsf@yahoo.com> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="20596"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: relekarpayas@gmail.com, larsi@gnus.org, gregory@heytings.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Aug 23 14:06:31 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oQSfv-0005BA-Ff for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2022 14:06:31 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43946 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oQSfu-0003Wm-DI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2022 08:06:30 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40822) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oQSel-0002l7-4n for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2022 08:05:19 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:54762) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oQSek-0007Gf-J7; Tue, 23 Aug 2022 08:05:18 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=yNxd86I+SO80TeFBmONuaA3sfGY2zft8GAHM676wXjE=; b=VvOJTFTCI2il Rsmlsr/BFMfsuPh5Owv+wjEwzlWO/Zw1Le2HQGe8JgTG/p1iCyM+yKL+9clFPeQvoWoAvl4FWi+yP Pw27N6MsNDv0HuP5tIcifYJtCxGhF3iLhWtKG2nF6jLCSn00EMHYhGN1tRUCx0n05ba26x0EsoWAJ A9bm0zh2a2fKEOynA/yu6FPulCE7IAkRWnjbjZB5LwO5aW4p2C67HbN2ywAxXBgxfCfOLT46UTRV7 w1AmTywJOsWpuQWkzmiUssb2jRSIVvWLVlKFMvvLvUWgS81NTozq5epFNquQWh3tSNQ5CDn8TkJ0e yD4S0+2Lm1D++P7byoGHVA==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2091 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oQSeb-0006tB-6M; Tue, 23 Aug 2022 08:05:18 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87pmgr8m3t.fsf@yahoo.com> (message from Po Lu on Tue, 23 Aug 2022 15:17:42 +0800) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:293870 Archived-At: > From: Po Lu > Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , Gregory Heytings > , emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2022 15:17:42 +0800 > > It will not affect Wayland at all, since the Wayland drag-and-drop API > is too limited to allow Emacs to implement drag-and-drop properly there. > > Most importantly, there is no way to cancel drag-and-drop after it > begins (think C-g), or to receive a notification when the pointer > reenters the frame where it originated after leaving. Why is this such a grave problem? E.g., to cancel drag-and-drop, the user can drop it onto some place where dropping is a no-op, like some window that doesn't accept drops or sometimes at the source from which the stuff was dragged. I never had any problems with this. Maybe we are again asking too much from the GUI environment, and too easily reject environments that are not 110% perfect? If so, it makes little sense to do that with Emacs, whose GUI aspects are secondary. > X will probably remain the primary window server for the next decade or > so. It is IMNSHO bad policy for a serious project that intends to remain alive for many years to put all of its eggs in a single basket. We should instead actively seek and try using alternative GUI environments, and we shouldn't reject them just because they are not perfect.