From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: "João Távora" <joaotavora@gmail.com>
Cc: arne_bab@web.de, jporterbugs@gmail.com, dmitry@gutov.dev,
emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot)
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 21:07:47 +0300 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <83pm7z7nkc.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CALDnm51zZw4JhnxCEUApN0N-90c08d-jOct5i2xcTMOhBb78=g@mail.gmail.com> (message from João Távora on Wed, 19 Apr 2023 18:21:23 +0100)
> From: João Távora <joaotavora@gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 18:21:23 +0100
> Cc: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" <arne_bab@web.de>, jporterbugs@gmail.com, dmitry@gutov.dev,
> emacs-devel@gnu.org
>
> But I acknowledge that if some user has
>
> (package-install always-has-been-a-core-package)
>
> in her Emacs 26/27/28 config, then some behaviour would have been
> changed with some of my previous solutions. I give you that, it
> doesn't need contesting.
>
> And that is why I later I gave a solution that _doesn't_,
> I repeat, _doesn't_ let that happen. That solution is in
>
> https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=62720#467
>
> It's a minimal patch, much smaller than the one that did make
> it in. I've linked to it many times now, but it has always
> been ignored by all except Philip and Dmitry, who said it was a
> "fine" solution and +1, respectively.
>
> It will _not_ update Xref and ElDoc _unless_ the user specifically
> asked for Eglot to be installed. Which is, of course, exactly what
> happened already in Emacs 28. For example, if the user has
>
> (package-install 'project)
>
> It _won't_ be updated. And neither will its dependency Xref. Again, just like
> in Emacs 28.
>
> Why are we ignoring my patch? What's really wrong with it? In
> technical terms, if possible.
It has similar problems: it will automatically update packages
mentioned in package--safely-upgradeable-builtins, which might not be
what users want for built-in packages. You assume that everyone will
want Eglot and use-package automatically updated, but this assumption
has no real basis. I object in general to any feature that
unexpectedly installs some software without the explicit user's
say-so.
Plus, it adds to the maintenance burden of maintaining this
(internal? not a defcustom??) variable for good.
Those issues were enough for me to reject the proposal.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2023-04-19 18:07 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 92+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <87a5zj2vfo.fsf@gmail.com>
[not found] ` <83wn2h5825.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <87wn2gkhzr.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <83cz485oxi.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <87leiwdyff.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <834jpk5hih.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <871qkom3fj.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <83mt3b4yfc.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <87edonlsxi.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <83jzyf4vzb.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <871qknllkj.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <83fs934pjf.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <87wn2fk47y.fsf@posteo.net>
[not found] ` <83sfd2g2ek.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <875y9yfxrr.fsf@gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CALDnm50-Su4SAGDSBiLjt0yrjrVsvyW71NSMi=zt7uHgv7rdng@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <87y1muefks.fsf@gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CALDnm50b6hRu+4EFqQDVydOF07HdiZT4nHA=aLDjYQKtMBTk2Q@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <fc2ed4a0-2368-682d-e34d-5cf94ac261fc@gutov.dev>
[not found] ` <CALDnm527Avsa-MBTD-bvRqOn52AeBLfPvffxjL-NB3tqM=43ZQ@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <834jpifizy.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <CALDnm53X5Yyn_EitG+iHJVx=RO2hjNaWkrgPz0+jKVWVM=eEBQ@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <83y1mue1qi.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <CALDnm51hmRMxstQdZdstA2LrbvYw=zD5=XRVy6uCU=Z+OmONRg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <83sfd2e01f.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <1a5e5837-513b-84d8-3260-cdbf42b71267@gutov.dev>
[not found] ` <83sfcz9rf2.fsf@gnu.org>
[not found] ` <09a49ab9-ac72-36a9-3e68-9c633710eba7@gutov.dev>
2023-04-18 12:57 ` Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot) Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-18 14:02 ` João Távora
2023-04-18 14:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-18 15:45 ` João Távora
2023-04-18 16:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-18 17:49 ` João Távora
2023-04-18 21:19 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-18 18:56 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-18 19:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-18 19:36 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 11:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 8:50 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 12:13 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2023-04-19 17:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 17:21 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 18:07 ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2023-04-19 18:14 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 18:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 19:33 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 4:26 ` tomas
2023-04-19 19:39 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 19:46 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 20:50 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 20:57 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 21:58 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 22:29 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 22:42 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 22:58 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 22:06 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 22:21 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 22:27 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 22:43 ` Jim Porter
[not found] ` <f32d7008-ea39-a9d7-8224-2c5b969236b7@gutov.dev>
[not found] ` <CALDnm53vPnODxpv_=nvOHRjLX-PfhyTS0MFudR0qZ3Pa-Lw-AQ@mail.gmail.com>
2023-04-19 23:25 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-20 0:13 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 1:13 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-20 1:49 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 2:04 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 19:15 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 9:38 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 9:48 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 11:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 12:00 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 12:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 12:24 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 17:35 ` John Yates
2023-04-19 17:42 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 18:04 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 19:35 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-20 9:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 19:40 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2023-04-20 6:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-29 5:21 ` Stability of core packages emacs
2023-04-29 6:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-29 21:47 ` Mohsen BANAN
2023-04-30 6:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-30 9:07 ` Philip Kaludercic
2023-04-30 13:12 ` Corwin Brust
2023-05-07 5:58 ` Mohsen BANAN
2023-05-05 4:36 ` David Masterson
2023-05-05 4:56 ` David Masterson
[not found] ` <878re3bdj6.fsf@penguin>
2023-05-05 4:59 ` David Masterson
2023-04-19 12:55 ` Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot) Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 13:18 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 13:44 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 14:13 ` João Távora
2023-04-18 22:10 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 8:34 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 12:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 18:22 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 18:37 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-19 19:32 ` Jim Porter
2023-04-19 22:51 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-04-20 13:47 ` history of ELPA packages and dependencies (was: Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot)) Lynn Winebarger
2023-04-20 13:58 ` Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot) Lynn Winebarger
2023-04-19 19:25 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-19 19:40 ` João Távora
2023-04-20 9:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 13:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-20 14:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 14:22 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-20 14:42 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 15:30 ` Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-20 15:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 17:26 ` Stability of core packages Philip Kaludercic
2023-04-20 18:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-04-20 21:25 ` Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot) Dmitry Gutov
2023-04-21 14:12 ` Lynn Winebarger
2023-04-19 12:31 ` What is :core? (was: Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot)) Lynn Winebarger
2023-04-19 12:57 ` João Távora
2023-04-19 13:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
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