From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Make all tree-sitter modes optional Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2023 16:20:56 +0200 Message-ID: <83o7qy4l2v.fsf@gnu.org> References: <84973.1672843723@hassadar.pretzelnet.org> <83wn62xi3k.fsf@gnu.org> <83o7rexe2n.fsf@gnu.org> <83h6x5xym7.fsf@gnu.org> <83h6wr6gmz.fsf@gnu.org> <831qnu64la.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="26349"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: casouri@gmail.com, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, larsi@gnus.org, theo@thornhill.no, jostein@secure.kjonigsen.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Jan 16 15:21:36 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pHQMi-0006gs-P3 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 16 Jan 2023 15:21:36 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHQM0-0007U1-2q; Mon, 16 Jan 2023 09:20:52 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHQLz-0007Ts-2H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 16 Jan 2023 09:20:51 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHQLy-00041B-4p; Mon, 16 Jan 2023 09:20:50 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=JZDUNzBBx4FWI5XL9jJYeaGnIk+WI67BBZWZw5Swx+k=; b=o+8j6PUX53fJ S6qUzY3vyuUXLEukOw1Ks4QSPLBYnL+De52GD6A4UB651U/xnzI8kmz5G11LYvX3hSL0xvgHYTeT0 gEZjea38qzmSTZAo3Z9PFncpfOb/qzituz3By3l/tRGYm31/dmsQM30IO3UkKKpcMQukAopR+pLiW T2qmd+1KajRsXatx2FGWvahnsRS5tEMV+EFrBIe2Yl2ivJPU6JikOD5xLyiqlPKbhEgpi16Z9KFrJ criBtbhU7CFRhNUI+h/J/OmtHJQrEYO2yId4jYxcIO2A5BEnrrWUlpJjChqpe2K3873HQumb2y1G6 tyrA+OECtU2SZi0yzoFp2A==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHQLx-0002Ny-K3; Mon, 16 Jan 2023 09:20:49 -0500 In-Reply-To: (message from Dmitry Gutov on Mon, 16 Jan 2023 15:06:15 +0200) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:302455 Archived-At: > Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2023 15:06:15 +0200 > Cc: casouri@gmail.com, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, larsi@gnus.org, > theo@thornhill.no, jostein@secure.kjonigsen.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org > From: Dmitry Gutov > > > . The proposed patch made many changes of auto-mode-alist > > conditional where they previously were _un_conditional. > > It also added some where there were none. Yes, so that we do this consistently. Inconsistency would lead to more confusion and difficulties in documentation. > > I submit > > that this is less annoyance in the important use case where the > > tree-sitter or the grammar library is not available. There are > > indications that this situation will be frequent enough when Emacs > > 29.1 hits the street. > > Like I said, either making them unconditional, or removing them, would > lead to better, more predictable behavior. OK, so let's disagree about this. > > . I don't buy the assumption that customizations of auto-mode-alist > > are frequent enough to make that an important factor in these > > decisions, let alone suggest that users should always do that if > > they want to try the *-ts-* modes seriously: > > Why wouldn't they be frequent? It's the only way for the user to have > file format supported, where we don't support it OOTB. I was talking about modes included in Emacs. > The customization of auto-mode-alist might also happen for the user > automatically. When the user installs a third-party package, such as > json-mode, from ELPA, that modified auto-mode-alist through package > autoloads. > > Having it modified again by 'M-x yaml-ts-mode', but only for the > duration of the current session, would be surprising and odd. If I were > a new user, I would be questioning both why the mode association > changed, and why it didn't persist between sessions. We disagree again. I guess we will have to wait and see who is right. > > - IME, auto-mode-alist is relatively rarely customized for modes > > that are included in Emacs (e.g., I don't customize entries of > > any such modes), for the simple reason that it is very rarely > > needed. > > I'm talking about modes which are not included in Emacs. Not relevant to this discussion.